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Nvidia officially launches GeForce GTS 250
Author: Ben HardwidgePublished: 3rd March 2009
With the GTS 250, the G92 GPU returns to the 9in PCB of the 512MB 8800 GTS and a very similar-looking cooler.
Sound familiar? There’s a good reason for that, which is that Nvidia’s GeForce 9800 GTX+ is based on the exact same GPU and has precisely the same clock speeds. There is, however, a very slight difference, which is that Nvidia is also introducing a 1GB edition of the card as standard, and increasing the stock memory clock from 1GHz (2GHz effective) to 1.1GHz (2.2GHz effective). Of course, you can already buy 1GB GeForce 9800 GTX+ cards anyway, but this gives the 1GB cards an official spec.
The other difference between the GeForce 9800 GTX+ and the GTS 250 is that the latter uses a slightly shorter 9in PCB, compared with the large 10.5in PCB on the former. The GTS 250 also only requires one PCI-E power connector, compared with two on the 9800 GTX+, and Nvidia says that the GTS 250 has a maximum TDP of 150W. Both of these factors will allow GTS 250 cards to fit into more cases, while also maintaining compatibility with older PSUs.
At this point, it’s also worth noting that the original GeForce 9800 GTX was also a rebranding of Nvidia’s 512MB GeForce 8800 GTS with slightly higher clock speeds and support for 3-way SLI and Hybrid Power.
After shrinking the G92 die from 65nm to 55nm and again upping the clock speed, Nvidia then had the GeForce 9800 GTX+. However, the original GeForce 8800 GTS also had a 9in PCB, as well as a cooler that looks suspiciously like the one on the GTS 250.
Nvidia’s general manager for GeForce, Ujesh Desai, admitted that "a lot of people think that Nvidia’s trying to pull the wool over people’s eyes," with the rebrand, but said "that’s not what we’re trying to do." According to Desai, the rebranding was the result of feedback from Nvidia’s customers, board partners and retailers who said that having two lines of GPUs was confusing. Desai said that the company had had "requests from our customers and our partners to try to clean up the branding, especially as we move her into the New Year, to clean up confusion that this is causing for some of the end users."
While this rebranding strategy might make sense for people buying a new GPU, it could be even more confusing for people who perhaps already own a 512MB GeForce 8800 GTS and think that the GTS 250 will offer a substantial upgrade. We put this question to Desai, who admitted that "unfortunately, there isn’t an ideal answer to that one." He added that "if you look at the original 8800 GTS 512, if you look at the performance of that vs the GTS 250, there will be a performance difference, so it’s not like it’s going to be the exact same performance as the older 8800 GTS 512."
We pointed out that this performance difference would be fractional, though, and hardly worth the money for a new graphics card, to which Desai said that "I think the customer who’s making that decision will look and they’ll see what the performance difference is." Desai also said that a lot of the guys who bought GeForce 8800 guys will "probably wait a year or two for the next big thing" rather than upgrading to another DirectX 10 card.
No UK pricing has been announced for the new cards yet, but the 1GB GeForce GTS 250 is set to cost around $149 US, with the 512MB card costing $129 US. Comparatively, before the launch of the GTS 250, a 512MB 9800 GTX card had an MSRP of $149 US, so the new cards will at least offer better value.
We're yet to get hold of a sample - we'll talk about that a bit more later - but we'll get a review online as soon as we can get one.
Update: Where's bit-tech's GeForce GTS 250 review?
Does it make sense for Nvidia to rebrand the GeForce 9800 GTX+ as the GeForce GTS 250, or does this make matters more confusing? Let us know your thoughts in the forums.
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"ATTENTION: This card is formerly known as the 8800GT and 8900GTX"
Does that sound like he's pouting to anyone else?
Anyhow, with the price drops on the 4850 and the 4870, I think NVIDIA is going to have a hard time selling this card. The 4850 still comes in at the same price as the "new" GTS 250, and the 4870 is only $20 USD more than that. As far as gaming goes, I see little reason to buy this card.
*waiting for the AMD price cut to arrive over here [the last one not the recent one] and for official prices from nVidia*
What is this??
That GPU shouldn't alive after so many different names.
I'm just going to buy a crossfire mobo, so I can buy a new cheap HD4870 to double my pc performance...
Who on earth buys a new GPU as an upgrade without reviewing its specifications and performance first in comparison to the one they already have ? If the answer is 'plenty of people' then the world is full of dumb lazy schmucks!
GTS250 is just a deceiving PO$... Same performance with small clocks increases...
Why the hell nVidia is so stagnant?
ATi is still inovating, nVidia is... milking... a GPU that already payed itself ages ago...
It's shameful
Now ATI's back in the game and making the RV740(cheap GDDR5 card) and the HD4850 at ridiculously low prices will just destroy Nvidia's competition.
Hell the lack of Cheap 9600GTs pisses me off as I can't buy an EVGA or a BFG one for under $100, and the lack of any good low-end cards from Nvidia is killing them as well(and pissing me off).
i thought when the GTX2 series hit we were going to see an end to ridiculous naming policies rehashing old cards, how many people who own the 9800GTX+ will end up walking into a shop and buying this? i suspect more than a couple, so i guess nvidia got what they wanted
...but if they do release it at the same price point... seriously... what's wrong with renaming it?
if it was 9800GTX, 9800GTX+, 260, 260core 216, 280, the regular joe would blow his head off...
but if its 250, 260, 280.... hmm.... yeah. at least poor old joe can tell that 250 is slower than 260 and 280 is even faster. duh.
relabeling old product = bad.
simplifying ur graphic line = good.
check most of the "pre-build" gamer machine. on any tier, they have more options on the nvidia cards instead of ATI. why? ATi runs as fast (or faster) for better cost! well, becoz nvidia sells. thats why.
again, unfortunate, but reading some of ur comments here that bash nvidia n think ATI is selling like hotcakes... lol.... yeah... sure. nvidia's doing wutever they want becoz they can. dont even think otherwise.
i wouldnt call probably 90% of the world population "dumb lazy schmucks". somebody u care for could be one of them.
I disagree to some extent. They layman has no idea how fast the churn is for the GPU market. Unless you are part of an online community like Bit-Tech.net or any of the other reputable sites out there, one would not have this industry knowledge. On the other hand, if you are just a fanboy then by all means you deserve the reaming you are getting.
And getting the same performance at less power consumption is hardly unwelcome.
As for sidestepping from a 8800 gts to a gts 250, it's highly unlikely. Anyone with such a dillema will usually ask for advice on a forum or from a more knowledgeable friend. Now, if they ask for advice at PC World it's another issue...
The power consumption gains will be marginal and as many people already pointed out the average customer won't ask anyone but the staff at PCW/Currys/Comet or any other shop with clueless shop assistants. And I don't think it'll only be a few customers "upgrading" from a 8800/9800 to a 250 as it seems to be a good idea. "You at least jump to the next generation at least!" is what they'll think.
Correct, two virtually identical lines of GPUs is confusing, but what is even more confusing is having three virtually identical lines.
Talk about trying to flush out your overstock of chips onto the clueless users...
What happened to "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"?
its the same fab, not the new fab so most likely most is overstock chips but they probably are producing some news ones, either way nothing is "new" about this and its nVidia pulling a sucker punch to its customers.
In other words, for building a brand new system, naming convention changes aren't a big deal, and are usually more helpful than not. But for upgrading a part in an existing system, you'd better know your stuff.
Don't forget that the 8800 GTS cost ~£230 when it was released. The 9800GTX+ costs £120. The target group is different. If you bought a high end product innitially, why would you opt for a midrange product as an upgrade? Common sense would suggest that you should go for the new high end product (GTX260).
People keep accusing nVidia for their ethics and not releasing a new product when ATI hasn't been able to release a single GPU card to compete with NV's flagship single gpu card for years. Maybe if Ati wasn't still competing with a 4 year card NV would be forced to change it.
Looking back, the HD3870 was only a slight improvement (performace wise) over the HD2900XT, yet vastly improved in terms of power consumption and also much cheaper than the HD2900XT (using 256bit mem as opposed to the 512bit mem of the 2900 and smaller fabrication process and priced to compete with the GTS). Everyone loved that card. Nobody saw it as a rebadged 2900XT since it solved such major flaws of the old card, despite the fact that performance was on the same level.
On the same note this logic is flawed as well, because ATI isn't trying to compete with Nvidia for the top dog of flagship single gpu cards. Go back and look at the pricing a year ago for that HD3870 as it compared to Nvidia's flag ship card.
It was competing with the GTS 512 price and performance wise. I don't see what you mean. I wasn't suggesting any particular logic, I was simply justifying NV's actions because they really don't need to do anything in the midrange since Ati hasn't yet offered anything to flat out blow this 4 year old card out of the waters.
WARNING: Nvidia Fan Boi Alert ~_~
Yes, some people are going to get confused, but an equal number will now be less confused than before.
It was a mess before, it's now a different mess
the point I think most people are making is they shouldnt make the card at all or if they have to sell it as that name then make it the same price as the 9800GTX+ not screw over its "not as educated" customers by charging more for the same card.
Original 8800GS: 92 SP.
9600GSO : 92SP
9600GSO 768mb DDR2..>_>..: 92SP
9600GSO 512mb 128bit: 48SP.
What gives?
Sorry to dissapoint but I'm not a "fanboy" of any company. I've used Ati, NV, Intel and AMD and always been happy with my purchases. The only criterion when choosing my hardware is price/performance.
The reason I don't object to NV's decision is because the card is perfectly matched against the competition in terms of price and performance, so let them call it whatever they want.
from guru3d:
The price looks pretty good to me. They are targeting the same price/performance group that the 9600GT did a year-or-so ago. It's not like their trying to sell a midrange product at high end prices to a high end market. They're selling a midrange product at midrange prices to the midrange market.
Almost another duck buying a rebranded nvidia card...
add a 4830 to that list....