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Carmack outlines vision for a new Quake

Carmack outlines vision for a new Quake

Quake is often considered the first true FPS.

John Carmack has outlined the direction he'd like to take the Quake series in the future, explaining to Eurogamer that there are factions within id Software that want to abandon the Strogg-based storyline of Quake 2 and Quake 4.

Carmack was adamant that the comments were purely speculative, however - there's no Quake title currently in development.

'We are at least tossing around the possibilities of going back to the bizarre, mixed up Cthulhu-ish Quake 1 world and rebooting that direction,' said Carmack. 'We certainly have strong factions internally that want to go do this.'

Todd Hollenshead, id CEO, also added: 'People shouldn't worry that we're ever going to orphan or abandon Quake. We are huge fans of the game internally.'

Quake was the first game to feature true three-dimensional FPS gameplay. Carmack suggests that it is not that good of a game, however, and says it's only remembered fondly because of the nostalgia.

'I look at the original Quake as this random thing, because we really didn't have our act together very well,' he says. 'Memory cuts us a lot of slack.'

id Software is currently working on Doom 4 which will purportedly go back to the original Doom-style gameplay as opposed to the more horror based style of Doom 3.

Do you have rose-tinted memories of Quake? Let us know your thoughts in the forums.

64 Comments

Discuss in the forums Reply
Bauul 17th June 2011, 11:49 Quote
The single player game of Quake was undoubetdly weird in presentation, but the second-to-second gameplay was very well developed, and that's why it became a multiplayer hit.
ChaosDefinesOrder 17th June 2011, 11:52 Quote
yes please, I loved romping around in the castles and the Lovecraftian elements!

the level were you emerge from a "well" into a graveyard and then zombies rise out of the ground and attack you was brilliant!
SMIFFYDUDE 17th June 2011, 11:52 Quote
I've had a PC since '98 and i've still not played any of the Quake games. A demo of Q2 and Q3 are as far as i've gone.
Pete J 17th June 2011, 11:53 Quote
Quote:
id Software is currently working on Doom 4 which will purportedly go back to the original Doom-style gameplay as opposed to the more horror based style of Doom 3.
Personally, I think that's taking a step back that isn't necessary. I'm glad that games have moved on from the simple gameplay of the original games like Doom and Quake. I like to fire up Painkiller or Serious Sam once in a while, but it's FPSs like FEAR and Crysis that I truly enjoy.

I imagine that there will be many who'll think the opposite however and will be glad to return to the old school, citing reasons such as 'a more pure experience'.
Jaffo 17th June 2011, 11:53 Quote
Prefer Q2 myself but Q4 was a pretty mediocre continuation of that story so going back to the original might produce something more interesting.
Jack_Pepsi 17th June 2011, 11:54 Quote
Playing Quake over dial up was my first online experience. One of my favourite games ever! I'd be happy enough to have a remake in the new engine tbh.
arcticstoat 17th June 2011, 11:54 Quote
I'd fully support this move - I didn't mind Quake II and 4, but they lacked the weird and original horror-esque atmosphere of the original (and severely underrated, IMHO) Quake game, even if it was overly brown. The Strogg storyline was always boring for me, and I'm liking the idea of unleashing a super nail gun on properly shaded shamblers and vores.
Phil Rhodes 17th June 2011, 12:09 Quote
Quote:
Quake is often considered the first true FPS.

By who?

Five year olds?
Sketchee 17th June 2011, 12:21 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Rhodes
By who?

Five year olds?

1996... so in my case 9 year olds :p

Nail Gun Cheesecake!
rinseout 17th June 2011, 12:38 Quote
I worked in an internet cafe and we had a big party for the launch of Quake after getting quite excited playing the demo for ages. Then when we got some 3dfx cards to evaluate and GLQuake, damn!
The glow around those rockets! I got pretty good at Quake, so much so that my boss banned me from playing the customers due to how many I put off by pwnage. I wish I had the time to spend with FPSs now as my skills are somewhat diminished without 12 hours a day to practice/work...
BRAWL 17th June 2011, 12:48 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sketchee
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Rhodes
By who?

Five year olds?

1996... so in my case 9 year olds :p

Nail Gun Cheesecake!

I was 8... yes so that'll work :D

Wow that'd be pretty cool. As long as they give me that kick-ass rocket launcher again I'd be happy.
digitaldunc 17th June 2011, 12:51 Quote
I certainly have rose tinted memories of Quake.

I miss the days when Id stood for real innovation in the gaming industry... Carmack still commands a great deal of reverence from me and always struck me as a guy who really knew what he was doing.

I don't see how a reboot could be done well, tbh. That ship has sailed -- I'd rather no reboot at all than another game from the increasingly indistinct FPS factory.
Ayrto 17th June 2011, 13:01 Quote
It may be just perception, but Carmack seems to throwing himself back into games development in a big way , and that has got to be a good thing. Many thought he was only interested in his space rocket propulsion projects.

Quake 4 was developed by Raven iirc as was Wolfenstein(2009). I think it's fair to say neither title did id's reputation much good. Hopefully their own in house built titles will restore id's rep to where it should be.
Grimloon 17th June 2011, 13:02 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Rhodes
By who?

Five year olds?

Early twenties for me.

Fond memories of the nailgun, gibbage galore and that soundtrack!
sotu1 17th June 2011, 13:40 Quote
"Quake is often considered the first true FPS."

You're really gonna have to justify that quote before teh flame trolls come out!
Ph4ZeD 17th June 2011, 13:43 Quote
I gave up expecting good games from ID after Doom 3, and I've been proved right time and time again.
DrTiCool 17th June 2011, 13:59 Quote
yep that soundtrack by Trent Reznor was weird as the whole game, anyway I loved it, actually had to bought entire new HW to play th game
Tokukachi 17th June 2011, 14:12 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by sotu1
"Quake is often considered the first true FPS."

You're really gonna have to justify that quote before teh flame trolls come out!

Quake was the first Full 3D FPS with mouselook and multiplayer.

The Terminator: Future Shock was full 3D and had mouselook, but no multiplayer, and no-one played it, or has even heard of it, so his statement stands as factually correct :)
Autti 17th June 2011, 14:13 Quote
Wolfenstein could be the first?

Quake was the best though.

Hmmm Q3 RA.
Gunsmith 17th June 2011, 14:29 Quote
[QUOTE=Neat69]
Quote:
Originally Posted by sotu1

The Terminator: Future Shock was full 3D and had mouselook, but no multiplayer, and no-one played it, or has even heard of it, so his statement stands as factually correct :)

i had it, it was rather good for its time.
Deders 17th June 2011, 14:39 Quote
After going from a 386SX with the original Wolfenstien to a PII 350, Quake was the first proper game I played on it so it wowed me, as did FF7. Going back to play it after playing Quake 2 I didn't find it as enjoyable, just like playing Quake 2 now after playing Half Life, Deus Ex and Far Cry. Once a game has innovated it's often hard to go back.

I do seem to remember a couple of fully realised monochrome shaded 3D FPS type game in space with pyramids on the ZX spectrum, but you'd be lucky to get 10FPS.
Grimloon 17th June 2011, 14:55 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Autti
Wolfenstein could be the first?

Wolfenstein was referred to as 3D b ut was really only 2D with some perspective gimmicks which were pretty revolutionary and awe inspiring at the time.
Deders 17th June 2011, 14:57 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimloon
Wolfenstein was referred to as 3D b ut was really only 2D with some perspective gimmicks which were pretty revolutionary and awe inspiring at the time.

Sort of 2.5D
Mankz 17th June 2011, 15:24 Quote
Q3 Team Area. Bestest game until I discovered UT..
sotu1 17th June 2011, 15:43 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neat69
Quote:
Originally Posted by sotu1
"Quake is often considered the first true FPS."

You're really gonna have to justify that quote before teh flame trolls come out!

Quake was the first Full 3D FPS with mouselook and multiplayer.

The Terminator: Future Shock was full 3D and had mouselook, but no multiplayer, and no-one played it, or has even heard of it, so his statement stands as factually correct :)

Err...Doom could be played with mouse and *pioneered* multiplayer?

Not to mention, FPS = first person shooter, not mouse based multiplayer.
Evildead666 17th June 2011, 17:01 Quote
Full 3D FPS. Doom wasn't full 3d, it had some visual effects to look like 3D in parts.
Quake was like the next logical step conceptually.
Evildead666 17th June 2011, 17:02 Quote
Doom did Make the genre though, for sure.
Bauul 17th June 2011, 17:23 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph4ZeD
I gave up expecting good games from ID after Doom 3, and I've been proved right time and time again.

Apart from a few browser based and mobile games, is software hasn't made a game since Doom 3.

On the subject of the first FPS: it was Wolf 3D, no argument.

As for 3D, I agree Wolf 3D wasn't - there was no height dimension, just forwards, backwards, left and right. Doom however definitely was 3D. Sectors could have different ceiling and floor heights. Granted, it was limited in what it could do, but no-one can say it didn't have three dimensions.
jrs77 17th June 2011, 17:28 Quote
They should take a look at Firefall take the style of Quake 1 and start to develop a nice MMO-FPS.

Singleplayer and/or some instanced multiplayer-maps are totally OOD.

I was allways more a fan of Unreal tho.
Deders 17th June 2011, 17:55 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bauul
Apart from a few browser based and mobile games, is software hasn't made a game since Doom 3.

On the subject of the first FPS: it was Wolf 3D, no argument.

As for 3D, I agree Wolf 3D wasn't - there was no height dimension, just forwards, backwards, left and right. Doom however definitely was 3D. Sectors could have different ceiling and floor heights. Granted, it was limited in what it could do, but no-one can say it didn't have three dimensions.

Doom was still 2.5D because even though there were varying heights, you couldn't have a room over a room, so effectively the floor plan could have been flat, although it would have made it easier to get to some areas if it was.
OCJunkie 17th June 2011, 18:32 Quote
Exactly, Quake wasn't the first FPS, but it was definitely the first actually 3D one.. either way despite the semantics Doom, Quake and Wolfenstein were all undeniably influential; just too bad they never really evolved apart from the graphics.

I'm definitely not opposed to a new Quake, especially if they're changing direction, but since Quake 4 and Doom 3 I'm just not expecting much.
Deders 17th June 2011, 18:51 Quote
Check these out, FPS in 1985 on the spectrum.

And Darkside, one in a series of FPS adventure games, you even had a jetpack (I think the pyramids were in a sequel.

There is a video near the bottom of the review.
Nexxo 17th June 2011, 19:29 Quote
Quake Is Good For you. ;)

Ah, good times, good times...
azrael- 17th June 2011, 20:18 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunsmith
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neat69
Quote:
Originally Posted by sotu1
"Quake is often considered the first true FPS."

You're really gonna have to justify that quote before teh flame trolls come out!
The Terminator: Future Shock was full 3D and had mouselook, but no multiplayer, and no-one played it, or has even heard of it, so his statement stands as factually correct :)

i had it, it was rather good for its time.
I *have* it and its successor SkyNet. But to be honest I consider System Shock to be the first true 3D FPS, considering it came out in 1994 (considering Quake is from 1996). Oh, and I still have Quake in the original box standing here too... :)
ssj12 17th June 2011, 20:20 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Rhodes
Quote:
Quake is often considered the first true FPS.

By who?

Five year olds?

Agreed, Wolfenstein 3D and Doom says hi to those who forget FPS history. And if I remember wasnt Tribes released around that time... and Unreal (the first single player one not Tournament)?
azrael- 17th June 2011, 20:24 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by ssj12
Agreed, Wolfenstein 3D and Doom says hi to those who forget FPS history. And if I remember wasnt Tribes released around that time... and Unreal (the first single player one not Tournament)?
Neither Wolfenstein 3D nor Doom were true 3D games. More like 2.5D. They had a 3D perspective but due to limitations in the engine you could only move in 2D.
CooLJoE 17th June 2011, 21:08 Quote
Did everyone forget about Duke Nukem 3D? Granted it came after Wolf 3D/Doom, but it did come before Quake, and was definitely an FPS and more 3D than Wolf 3D/Doom by far. Going by the definition of FPS, there are quite a few games that came before Quake that were of the FPS genre. Although to me, Doom and Duke 3D were the ones that made FPS multiplayer gaming what it is today (more so Duke 3D, IMO). Wolf 3D was definitely the one that got the FPS genre going strong.
CooLJoE 17th June 2011, 21:11 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by ssj12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Rhodes
Quote:
Quake is often considered the first true FPS.

By who?

Five year olds?

Agreed, Wolfenstein 3D and Doom says hi to those who forget FPS history. And if I remember wasnt Tribes released around that time... and Unreal (the first single player one not Tournament)?

Tribes, although a good FPS multiplayer game, was released in 1998, 2 years after Quake. Unreal (non-tournament, the original) was also released in 1998. I had all 3 when they came out. Great games, each of them. Still have the games somewhere.
Grimloon 17th June 2011, 21:26 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by azrael-
Neither Wolfenstein 3D nor Doom were true 3D games. More like 2.5D. They had a 3D perspective but due to limitations in the engine you could only move in 2D.

^What he said. Three dimensional maps? Kind of, they had up and down a bit and perspective but that's about it. Opfor? 2D all the way, flat sprites with no depth. Even the blood spatter was 2D. Quake was the first one I played to use full 3D for everything - environment, enemies and gibbage. Unreal still stands on it's own as a truly glorious game (I got my Voodoo 2 16 MB accelerator card for that - truly awesome kit at the time!) but it was a touch later (1998). The Quake mods were also well worth playing, I ran through as many as I could on a 33,600 kbps connection.

@CooLJoE: Ninja'd dagnabbit!

@Deders: Quake was the dawn of the 3D PC FPS, other platforms did it first but where are they now? One, at least, is sat on top of my wardrobe in a box - Atari 1040 STE with a shoebox full of games disks.
greypilgers 17th June 2011, 21:37 Quote
This is not news. This is a waste of space on the bit-tech site. I thought there was an article recently within Bit-Tech that said 'non-news' like this wouldn't be published? COme on, Bit-Tech - practice what you preach, please.
The man says himself that there is nothing in production, nothing set for production, hence these are just musings and casual comments likely bandied about with no real meaning or agenda, or worse, distributed knowing the effect they will have on forums and news sites to garner more attention for iD software to hopefully hide the fact that they are an irrelevance these days, and have been for a while. When was the last decent iD game? Carmack often talks the talk but seems immobile on the quality front.
chrisb2e9 17th June 2011, 21:50 Quote
Quote:
Quake was the first game to feature true three-dimensional FPS gameplay.

Descent came out in 1995 and was full 3d.
greypilgers 17th June 2011, 21:59 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisb2e9
Descent came out in 1995 and was full 3d.

+1 to this. Although would we class Descent as a proper First Person Shooter?
chrisb2e9 17th June 2011, 22:00 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by greypilgers
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisb2e9
Descent came out in 1995 and was full 3d.

+1 to this. Although would we class Descent as a proper First Person Shooter?

I would. It was played in first person perspective.
And you shot stuff. Hence first person shooter.
greypilgers 17th June 2011, 22:08 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisb2e9
I would. It was played in first person perspective.
And you shot stuff. Hence first person shooter.

Ha ha! Touche! Good call, my man. I stand corrected. You are an oak.

;)
Grimloon 17th June 2011, 22:46 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisb2e9
I would. It was played in first person perspective.
And you shot stuff. Hence first person shooter.

Yes and no. OK, it predated Quake by a year or so but you were flying a ship, not there in person as it were. The HUD was a major ballache as parts of your view were perpetually blocked off. I played (and still have the original CDs for) Descent 1,2 & 3 but they never spelled FPS to me in the same way that Quake did. Space sim meets FPS and occasional puzzle game? Oh aye, that'd be Descent then. Pure FPS carnage and glory? Quake, hands down and no questions asked!

Need I even mention the multiplayer aspect and mods produced?
chrisb2e9 17th June 2011, 22:56 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimloon
Yes and no. OK, it predated Quake by a year or so but you were flying a ship, not there in person as it were. The HUD was a major ballache as parts of your view were perpetually blocked off. I played (and still have the original CDs for) Descent 1,2 & 3 but they never spelled FPS to me in the same way that Quake did. Space sim meets FPS and occasional puzzle game? Oh aye, that'd be Descent then. Pure FPS carnage and glory? Quake, hands down and no questions asked!

Need I even mention the multiplayer aspect and mods produced?

Meh, I still call it a first person shooter because it was played in that perspective. Not over the shoulder, not from behind a ship, but from the perspective of a pilot who happened to be in a ship.
As for the hud. press f3 and it was gone.
And if you replace the robots with zombies then you have the carnage you speak of. Although I think that shooting out screens, blowing up doors, reactors, masses of insane robots is carnage enough. Tit for tat.

And what about multiplayer? Descent had it in spades. I wasted many hours playing with friends via 14.4K modem or even on Kali.
True there wasn't a lot for mods, but you could change sounds or make maps(I made some great ones(in my opinion)). Modding was in its infancy back then.

So quake first FPS? no.
Deders 17th June 2011, 23:06 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimloon
@Deders: Quake was the dawn of the 3D PC FPS, other platforms did it first but where are they now? One, at least, is sat on top of my wardrobe in a box - Atari 1040 STE with a shoebox full of games disks.

True, but PC isn't mentioned once in the artical.
Grimloon 17th June 2011, 23:56 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisb2e9
Meh, I still call it a first person shooter because it was played in that perspective. Not over the shoulder, not from behind a ship, but from the perspective of a pilot who happened to be in a ship.
As for the hud. press f3 and it was gone.
And if you replace the robots with zombies then you have the carnage you speak of. Although I think that shooting out screens, blowing up doors, reactors, masses of insane robots is carnage enough. Tit for tat.

And what about multiplayer? Descent had it in spades. I wasted many hours playing with friends via 14.4K modem or even on Kali.
True there wasn't a lot for mods, but you could change sounds or make maps(I made some great ones(in my opinion)). Modding was in its infancy back then.

So quake first FPS? no.

I acknowledge defeat! Quake was the first true FPS for me but then again I remember Legend as being a truly awesome RPG. Dinosaur? Me? Maybe a touch. Descent was many, many hours of fun. I wasn't on t'internet when it came out though so probably missed a lot. CS was my first online game and then only on HPB servers! Connection was so crap that the only way I could get kills was to leg it in to the room with a primed grenade and take as many of them with me as possible.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deders
True, but PC isn't mentioned once in the artical.

Yep, I noticed that too but Quake was PC all the way until significantly later in its life cycle. Quake, back in the day, was the game. The question of "Can it play Crysis?" has been bandied around so much now that it's a meme (my system has yet to answer this, don't know and don't care) but at the time it was very much a case of "Have you played Quake?" I had, I did and it has somewhat shaped gaming for me. Then again, I'm not the average bod and have been tinkering with PCs for 28 years now - I remember translating games from A N Other basic to MS Quick Basic so I could enter and then play them. Quake still is, and always will be, a milestone for many of us.

Should Mr Carmack provide Quake with modern graphics - I'd buy that for a dollar! Hell, I'd buy it for the national debt of a small, third world country!
brave758 18th June 2011, 01:53 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Rhodes
Quote:
Quake is often considered the first true FPS.

By who?

Five year olds?
thehippoz 18th June 2011, 03:00 Quote
quake 2 and wolfenstien enemy territory were really well done I thought

something about those games that really brings back a lot of good teamwork, cs was good too

and in quake 2- the duels were some of the best
altdoom 18th June 2011, 05:22 Quote
I was actually thinking id should do this last night and then I read this article, weird.
Digi 18th June 2011, 07:47 Quote
I like the fact he is realist enough to say it's mostly nostalgia that keeps the game fond in gamers minds. That's an honest and true quote if I ever saw one. Roll on Carmack, I'm with you in whatever you have planned next.
DocWolfe 18th June 2011, 10:38 Quote
Good... can't beat a good shambler blasting you with his lightening bolts.
dark_avenger 19th June 2011, 13:11 Quote
Loved playing MP in the first Quake, doesn't quite feel the same now though.... :(
Sheiken 19th June 2011, 13:15 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deders
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimloon
Wolfenstein was referred to as 3D b ut was really only 2D with some perspective gimmicks which were pretty revolutionary and awe inspiring at the time.

Sort of 2.5D

You think people back then moaned as much about going to 3d as we are today? :P

Yes I know we are talking two completely different technologies. Just a mildly amusing brainfart
Star*Dagger 20th June 2011, 09:39 Quote
Carmack is a God of Gaming, and if you ever had the pleasure of spending a few days at iD you would heartily agree. He has done more to advance the FPS genre than the next 4 people below him (and those 4 people would agree).

Yours in iD Plasma,
Star*Dagger
Ljs 20th June 2011, 10:49 Quote
FPS has moved on a bit now from those days. Personally I think they should spend their time creating a decent new IP (also what a lot of other people should do) unstead of floggin the only horse they have.

A new Quake game wouldn't really enter my line of sight unless it was utterly amazing which lets face it, itsn't going to happen.

Maybe revisit the Quake franchise after creating some else worthwhile to squeeze the life out of for another 15 years?
Sheiken 20th June 2011, 12:27 Quote
Well they are working on Rage, iirc
Ghost_Bill 20th June 2011, 12:42 Quote
3D Realms - 1995 - Terminal Velocity
Does anyone remembers this one, similar to descent style but still quite good for its time.
cypressgroove 20th June 2011, 13:53 Quote
First 'true 3d' FPS? Well good people, that would be the oft-forgotten Rise of the Triad which I recall getting from dialling a BBS in the states just before the xmas of my 14th birthday (1994). It had 'true' 3d in that you could have rooms above/below other rooms as well as ELEVEN player multiplayer...

I recall being somewhat blown away by it at the time.

NB: Oh yeah I also remember it had the most EPIC god mode cheat of any game. Not only did you become invulnerable, but you could also float at will and shoot 'god-smiting-balls' which insta-gibbed any enemy.
Ghost_Bill 20th June 2011, 14:01 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by cypressgroove
First 'true 3d' FPS? Well good people, that would be the oft-forgotten Rise of the Triad which I recall getting from dialling a BBS in the states just before the xmas of my 14th birthday (1994). It had 'true' 3d in that you could have rooms above/below other rooms as well as ELEVEN player multiplayer...

I recall being somewhat blown away by it at the time.

NB: Oh yeah I also remember it had the most EPIC god mode cheat of any game. Not only did you become invulnerable, but you could also float at will and shoot 'god-smiting-balls' which insta-gibbed any enemy.

LoL you're right
Denis_iii 20th June 2011, 14:30 Quote
The original Quake is one of my all time favorite FPS', I did not enjoy any of the sequels aside from Q3A which had a great feel and would have been awesome if had a single player campaign.
If ID goes back to the form of Quake, Q3A, Doom 1/2 and Wolfenstein the future is looking good.
hexx 20th June 2011, 16:43 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisb2e9
Quote:
Quake was the first game to feature true three-dimensional FPS gameplay.

Descent came out in 1995 and was full 3d.

Descent!!! this brings so many memories :) we used to play this on LAN for hours and hours, mixed with Duke 3D and one of the C&C games, until hub burned hehehehee
hexx 20th June 2011, 16:45 Quote
Doom was the first one of this kind for me, wolf was there but not quite there. I know Quake was first proper 3D but who doesn't remember these: IDKFA, IDDQD, IDCLIP?
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