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Blizzard bans singleplayer cheaters

Blizzard bans singleplayer cheaters

Blizzard has moved to ban players who cheat in StarCraft 2, even if only in singleplayer.

Blizzard has reportedly moved to ban players who cheat in StarCraft 2, even if they've only done so in the singleplayer campaign and matches against the AI, according to CheatHappens.

Users who claim they had never played StarCraft 2's multiplayer were apparently told that they had been banned for using trainers and third-party cheats in the singleplayer portion of the game. One player, Gm0ney, claims to have been given a 14 day (336 hour) ban for using trainers in offline matches against the AI.

Blizzard has since defended itself, saying that the actions fit with StarCraft 2's EULA, which reserves the right to ban players for cheating.

While single player games only appear to be you and a computer at first, your achievements and gamer score also carries weight and prestige for your online play,” a Blizzard spokesperson told CheatHappens.

CheatHappens, which has created and distributed trainers for StarCraft 2, has questioned the legality of the move and claimed that the cheats it distributes "help put the control back in the hands of the end-user and let them play the game the way they want to play it."

"As long as these cheats don’t affect anyone but the person using them, why does anyone care?" said CheatHappens' Content Editor Chris O'Rorke. "It’s not affecting any type of online ladders or standings or interrupting another person’s game."

I don’t think it’s fair and I would even go as far as to question its legality. I can completely understand, and even support, the banning of users that are intentionally cheating [in] multiplayer games as this affects more than just the person doing the cheating,” said O'Rorke. “However, banning people for cheating in a single player game is utterly ridiculous.

Read our StarCraft 2 review for more information on the game, or let us know your thoughts in the forums.

93 Comments

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liratheal 11th October 2010, 16:38 Quote
lol

At both the complaining and the idea of banning for single player cheating.
Fizzban 11th October 2010, 16:40 Quote
“However, banning people for cheating in a single player game is utterly ridiculous.”

This! Who cares if it affects your achievements. You judge other players by how they game, not by what achievements they unlock.
neonplanet40 11th October 2010, 16:57 Quote
Glad I havent bought this game! Wont be now either - I dont need to play it. I wont have someone tell me If i can use cheats in single player or not. Joke tbh
wuyanxu 11th October 2010, 17:04 Quote
Blizzard: the giant that will fall. i'd like to think of them as IBM during 70s, soon, they'd be forgotten.

i don't get the buzz surrounding this company. none of their game is remotely exciting. on the other hand, im not an RPG fan, and my APM is about 10.
mclean007 11th October 2010, 17:05 Quote
Hmmm... I think we can start by all agreeing that this is only controversial because it is being used on single player gamers. Cheating in multiplayer is inexcusable and should result in an instant ban and revocation of the player's licence code from being used in online games, at least for a temporary period (with multiple infractions leading to a permanent ban).

On single player, personally I've never seen the need to cheat. I can see their argument that cheating in SP can affect your stats and unlockables, but maybe the solution is to have a "practice" mode which doesn't censor cheating but equally doesn't count stats, good or bad, towards your overall ranking. Whatever, there must be a solution less heavy handed than temp bans for players using trainers in SP.
Centy-face 11th October 2010, 17:08 Quote
Yeah well that certainly is one way to encourage piracy I guess since that is the first thing that occurred to me. Imagine Valve said when you load a game of Left 4 Dead solo turning cheats on even just noclip to check out the map bans you. What utter bullshit.

Like neonplanet40 I'm not going to be told how to play a game and even though I was hoping to see it cheap later in the year now Im glad I passed up on getting it at launch and it looks ever more certain that Warcraft 3 will be the last Blizzard game I hand over cash for.
HourBeforeDawn 11th October 2010, 17:12 Quote
Well I suppose in some manner this will teach kids that cheating doesnt gain you anything other then false satisfaction for achieving something that you didnt achieve but at the same time this being single player does seem a bit much.
javaman 11th October 2010, 17:13 Quote
Next they'll ban you for using add ons. Play the game our way or no way at all? Remind you of any other company?
DriftCarl 11th October 2010, 17:16 Quote
Why would anyone cheat in single player? The only reason is to get hard achievements to show off to their friends or the online community, if they want to have an easier time going through the single player game then they can simply change the difficulty to easy.
99.9% of players who download these maphack cheats will do so to cheat in online play. Especially since there is now some money involved in alot of tournaments, and no way for the organisers to really know if a player is cheating or not. Ban them all i say.

if you want to cheat in single player, then disable your network card, play in offline mode and then remove the cheats when done.
Simple no?
Centy-face 11th October 2010, 17:18 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by HourBeforeDawn
Well I suppose in some manner this will teach kids that cheating doesnt gain you anything other then false satisfaction for achieving something that you didnt achieve but at the same time this being single player does seem a bit much.

So you've never wanted to open up an RTS and just produce a hundred unit just to see what its like or open up L4D and spawn 12 tanks to mess the survivor bots up ust too see what happens. Achievements are meaningless things anyway since there's no central portal for it like xbl or psn
DarkLord7854 11th October 2010, 17:18 Quote
Joy.. banned for using a trainer in singleplayer. Thankfully it's only temporary. I've never had a reason to dislike Blizzard, quite the opposite in fact, but getting my account banned for having fun in singleplayer ticks me off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HourBeforeDawn
Well I suppose in some manner this will teach kids that cheating doesnt gain you anything other then false satisfaction for achieving something that you didnt achieve but at the same time this being single player does seem a bit much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DriftCarl
Why would anyone cheat in single player? The only reason is to get hard achievements to show off to their friends or the online community, if they want to have an easier time going through the single player game then they can simply change the difficulty to easy.
99.9% of players who download these maphack cheats will do so to cheat in online play. Especially since there is now some money involved in alot of tournaments, and no way for the organisers to really know if a player is cheating or not. Ban them all i say.

if you want to cheat in single player, then disable your network card, play in offline mode and then remove the cheats when done.
Simple no?

Just because someone wants to have fun in Singleplayer by altering the game doesn't mean they're just trying for achievements, nor even that they would be more inclined to attempt to cheat online.

I enjoy using a trainer in SC2 because it changes the rules of the game and lets me do ridiculous things.. like having a photon cannon that can shoot across the map. It's purely for sh*ts and giggles.
DriftCarl 11th October 2010, 17:29 Quote
Quote:


Just because someone wants to have fun in Singleplayer by altering the game doesn't mean they're just trying for achievements, nor even that they would be more inclined to attempt to cheat online.

I enjoy using a trainer in SC2 because it changes the rules of the game and lets me do ridiculous things.. like having a photon cannon that can shoot across the map. It's purely for sh*ts and giggles.

you should try using the map editor then, thats what its there for, already built into the game, no need to go searching for hacks.
The_Beast 11th October 2010, 17:34 Quote
In single player, cheat all you want. But in multiplayer GTFO NOW, I hate your soul and you should burn in hell forever.
robots 11th October 2010, 17:36 Quote
All this makes me think is that the achievements weren't thought out thoroughly enough.
DarkLord7854 11th October 2010, 17:37 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by DriftCarl
you should try using the map editor then, thats what its there for, already built into the game, no need to go searching for hacks.

I don't have the time, nor desire, to learn how to use the editor, nor does it let me edit built-in maps.

Me using a trainer in Singleplayer has no affect on multiplayer other than worthless achievements which are only a testament to how many hours you've theoretically sunk into the game.
r3loaded 11th October 2010, 17:49 Quote
And people still hand over their cash to Activi$ion? If you buy one of their games, you ought to know exactly what you're getting into. It's much the same as buying Apple hardware - I ain't gonna stop you, but I sure have warned you.
Jewels 11th October 2010, 17:57 Quote
Playing offline, thereby disabling the ability to earn achievements, would be the way to use a trainer no?
HourBeforeDawn 11th October 2010, 18:00 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Centy-face
Quote:
Originally Posted by HourBeforeDawn
Well I suppose in some manner this will teach kids that cheating doesnt gain you anything other then false satisfaction for achieving something that you didnt achieve but at the same time this being single player does seem a bit much.

So you've never wanted to open up an RTS and just produce a hundred unit just to see what its like or open up L4D and spawn 12 tanks to mess the survivor bots up ust too see what happens. Achievements are meaningless things anyway since there's no central portal for it like xbl or psn

nope but your talking about altering game events, Im talking about cheating to progress ones self without actually achieving the progress themselves or giving yourself the ability always have head shots, that form of cheating.
V3ctor 11th October 2010, 18:03 Quote
Jeezz....... Not even single player?? This is like Big Brother, even this on single-player? This is an abuse...
knyghtryda 11th October 2010, 18:09 Quote
I'm all for the banhammer for multiplayer cheating, but come on... single player? Really? who cares about someone who has a few more achievement points than someone else. It still doesn't have any effect on your ladder standing, which is where the real "prestige" lies. Hopefully enough backlash will come of this for Blizzard to backtrack a bit.
G0UDG 11th October 2010, 18:12 Quote
I have to agree banning for cheating in single playing is stupid but then again cheating itself is both stupid and sad as it takes way the challenge of a game and therefore the fun for me at least.
s3v3n 11th October 2010, 18:13 Quote
This is just some kid trying to get achievements the easy way. You can already do almost all of the cheats those trainers give you with ingame commands. It merely disables achievements. So pretty much the only reason to do this is to get Kerrigan avatar or something, but they suck so they cheat.
As shitty as bnet is sometimes I agree with them on this. If they really want to cheat, play offline. Logging on and playing campaign is still online.
Jewels 11th October 2010, 18:17 Quote
Blizzard obviously differentiates between online singleplayer and offline singleplayer. I doubt it bans users for cheating offline, trainers or otherwise.
Woodspoon 11th October 2010, 18:28 Quote
Hmmmm tricky
On the surface of it, it does seem stupid banning people for cheating in single player mode.
But.....
If that cheating affects your achievements and standings then that will probably affect how your ranked online which isn't fair to others.
I can see what their getting at, their just not doing it very well.
neonplanet40 11th October 2010, 18:30 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by DriftCarl

if you want to cheat in single player, then disable your network card, play in offline mode and then remove the cheats when done.
Simple no?

Why the hell; should I disable bits of my computer to use a trainer in SP? Thats rediculous. It should not be a problem to be honest. I use cheats in single player and HAVE NEVER cheated online - ever!

What are they going to tell me next? Im only allowed to pick a certain team on a given day? Its just rediculous to the point were I think its actually jsut a very early april fool's joke. It will boost piracy though so - GO EA!! Ooops i mean blizzard.....
GFC 11th October 2010, 18:33 Quote
It's not like it's a permanent ban. It seems from the post that they only got more of a suspension than a real ban.
Also, I grinded out all of the SP achievements, which took me probably near to a hundred hours, so I'd be really pis*ed if some guy just got them by pressing the "magic button". Other than achievements though - I have nothing against cheating in SP, although I don't (or plan to) do that.
Daedelus 11th October 2010, 18:33 Quote
It seems a bit harsh but on the other hand, anyone who cheats at a game, even if it's only single player, deserves to be punished.

Makes you wonder why people play games at all if they are just going to cheat. As the saying goes - "You're only cheating yourself" !
DriftCarl 11th October 2010, 18:41 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by neonplanet40


Why the hell; should I disable bits of my computer to use a trainer in SP? Thats rediculous. It should not be a problem to be honest. I use cheats in single player and HAVE NEVER cheated online - ever!

What are they going to tell me next? Im only allowed to pick a certain team on a given day? Its just rediculous to the point were I think its actually jsut a very early april fool's joke. It will boost piracy though so - GO EA!! Ooops i mean blizzard.....

It is probably the fact that they can only detect the cheat on your system rather than if you are using it in single player or multi player. I would rather have them ban anyone who installs a cheat than them being too scared to ban in case they accidentally ban those very few who use it in single player.

I totally agree that single player should purely be offline and shouldnt have any connections to online play, that is a blunder by blizzard. But on the other hand the multi players are the ones that will play this game the longest and don't want to be plagued with counter strike levels of cheating.
Dominatorbuster 11th October 2010, 18:54 Quote
This is great news, well done Blizzard! I'm glad a company is taking a strong stand against cheats and banning them.

The thing is, if you cheat in single player then there's a chance that you might cheat in multiplayer as well. Of course there will be some who cheat in single player but not in multiplayer, if a few get banned in single player that don't cheat in multiplayer but hundreds who cheat in singleplayer and multiplayer get banned then that to me is acceptable.

The simple solution is not to cheat, work for those stats, when you've completed an acheivement then you get a sense of achievement. Too many kiddies want things to be instant, a quick fix, wish blizzard made every game out there because with them at the helm online gaming would be great without cheats ruining it.

And on the subject of cheating in a different game, there was a thread about cheating in magic the gathering duels of the planeswalker on the steam forums. Now it was said edited decks couldn't be brought online, this was proved to be wrong as I had run into the vampire deck online. Now if blizzard ran that game, that player would never have got a chance to cheat online.
Volund 11th October 2010, 19:24 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominatorbuster
This is great news, well done Blizzard! I'm glad a company is taking a strong stand against cheats and banning them.

The thing is, if you cheat in single player then there's a chance that you might cheat in multiplayer as well. Of course there will be some who cheat in single player but not in multiplayer, if a few get banned in single player that don't cheat in multiplayer but hundreds who cheat in singleplayer and multiplayer get banned then that to me is acceptable.

The simple solution is not to cheat, work for those stats, when you've completed an acheivement then you get a sense of achievement. Too many kiddies want things to be instant, a quick fix, wish blizzard made every game out there because with them at the helm online gaming would be great without cheats ruining it.

the whole idea of a company punishing all it's paying customers to prevent something that a few are involved in is bad business and a good reason for users to stop buying their products.

It's not ok that people get banned for cheating in SP, you don't see valve disabling mods or console in HL2 or Portal to prevent cheating to get achievements, because cheating for achievements makes them worthless to the person earning them. Either you put the time into getting them, or you don't, one or the other. Achievements DON'T MATTER in real life except for 13 year olds who have no real skills in multiplayer.

really, cheating in SP should be a non-issue, as SP is for fun, not competition. If someone wants to cheat, let them, because it really doesn't affect other people.
jrs77 11th October 2010, 19:42 Quote
The question is not about offline-training, but about online-gamestats.

So allthough I can understand the rage about this one, but with the online-thingy for the solo-player-achievements Blizzard actually has every right to ban those, who used cheats to get the achievements, even if they don't mean jack to you.

Like others allready said, just go offline and happily use the trainers/cheats/hacks without regrets, but while connected to their servers you simply don't do it - that's just common sense.
Blackie Chan 11th October 2010, 19:46 Quote
power overwhelming
black sheep wall
operation cwal
etc...
yeah blizzard is waay anti cheat, cheating is just what you do when yo don't know how to make play good game in yoyr computer all day when you can't know what how to why have fun when you don't win and l2p nub JAJAJAJAJAJAJAAA
eddtox 11th October 2010, 21:39 Quote
Yet another reason why they don't get my money.
Dominatorbuster 11th October 2010, 21:40 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Volund
really, cheating in SP should be a non-issue, as SP is for fun, not competition. If someone wants to cheat, let them, because it really doesn't affect other people.

That's like saying if people want to smoke cannabis in their own home then let them. The problem is cannabis leads to other drugs, which in turn effects everyone else and has a devastating effect on themselves.

That's why single player cheating should be banned because it lowers players moral levels, one minute they're cheating in single player, the next in multiplayer because they've conditioned themselves to think cheating is ok, it's not and should be banned in single player aswell.

Clearly some players will not like this, they see it as someone telling them what they can and can not do, but sometimes in life you have to tell people who have no morals what they can and can not do. You have to look at the bigger picture, it's more than just cheating in a game, it's also what cheating leads to in single player games. It's leads to cheating in multiplayer games, it can also lead to cheating in life as well.

So maybe next time you see some kind of crime, just stop for one moment and think about the person who has committed that crime, the criminal has no morals, morals which are formed at an early stage of people's life, but hey according to the people who think bans are bad then that's ok right? Go ahead and let them cheat right? It's later in life that such morals a truly exposed because they weren't formed correctly in life, cheating in video games can play a big factor in someone's real life morals.
Glix 11th October 2010, 21:52 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominatorbuster
Quote:
Originally Posted by Volund
really, cheating in SP should be a non-issue, as SP is for fun, not competition. If someone wants to cheat, let them, because it really doesn't affect other people.

That's like saying if people want to smoke cannabis in their own home then let them. The problem is cannabis leads to other drugs, which in turn effects everyone else and has a devastating effect on themselves.

That's why single player cheating should be banned because it lowers players moral levels, one minute they're cheating in single player, the next in multiplayer because they've conditioned themselves to think cheating is ok, it's not and should be banned in single player aswell.

You talk rot.

For some people, they just want to progress in a game. This is single player ONLY. Stats and rankings for completing the single player? Get a life if you actually care about those.

/godmode on
supermonkey 11th October 2010, 22:06 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominatorbuster
That's like saying if people want to smoke cannabis in their own home then let them. The problem is cannabis leads to other drugs, which in turn effects everyone else and has a devastating effect on themselves.
Cannabis is hardly a gateway drug. Here in America, one reason some people progress from cannabis to harder drugs is because you have to buy weed on the black market and smoke it in secret. Pushing the drug into the criminal realm is what invites users to move onto to harder things. We can look to Amsterdam or Greece to see examples of societies in which decriminalized cannabis use has not brought about a complete downfall of moral values.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominatorbuster
So maybe next time you see some kind of crime, just stop for one moment and think about the person who has committed that crime, the criminal has no morals, morals which are formed at an early stage of people's life, but hey according to the people who think bans are bad then that's ok right? Go ahead and let them cheat right? It's later in life that such morals a truly exposed because they weren't formed correctly in life, cheating in video games can play a big factor in someone's real life morals.
Are you seriously suggesting that cheating in a single player game will lead to criminal behavior and an overall breakdown in society's moral fabric? Maybe that's why I still eat meat.
Dominatorbuster 11th October 2010, 22:13 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glix
You talk rot.

For some people, they just want to progress in a game. This is single player ONLY. Stats and rankings for completing the single player? Get a life if you actually care about those.

/godmode on

From a psychological point what I wrote is spot on, clearly above your intelligence for you to truly understand, maybe I should I should have put a few lol's and rofl's to reach your level.

Everyone likes to progress in a game, sometimes we get in stuck in game though and it's all too easy to fall into the cheat trap. But once you do cheat, even in single player, it's a slippery slope that leads to other bad things.

Kids today want things now, an instant fix, they're not prepared to work at it, if it's hard they look for a cheat. My generation didn't have cheats like you have today, now you have hundreds of cheat websites, hundreds of hacks. It made us more skilful because we had to work at the problem, it made us better people on a moral level.
ZERO <ibis> 11th October 2010, 22:26 Quote
Seriously who never used the gameshark back in the day to replay games you already beat just to mess around. I think it is stupid to ban for cheating in single player b/c for that player it can be part of the game. After you have already finished a game it can be fun to turn all the hacks on and just mess around. Think about getting plastered and then playing goldeneye with all the hacks on, good times. Cheating is just another way of playing the game and having some fun for some players and as long as it sticks to single player it should be allowed.
Dominatorbuster 11th October 2010, 22:37 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by supermonkey
Cannabis is hardly a gateway drug. Here in America, one reason some people progress from cannabis to harder drugs is because you have to buy weed on the black market and smoke it in secret. Pushing the drug into the criminal realm is what invites users to move onto to harder things. We can look to Amsterdam or Greece to see examples of societies in which decriminalized cannabis use has not brought about a complete downfall of moral values.


Are you seriously suggesting that cheating in a single player game will lead to criminal behavior and an overall breakdown in society's moral fabric? Maybe that's why I still eat meat.

Yes I am suggesting that, there is nothing positive about cheating, all it can do is lead to bad things, things that seem unconnected at the time.

I would say making cannabis legal is what invites users onto harder things, if it's legal then you could say the drug loses it's appeal. So what do you do? Make the harder drugs legal? No of course not, you do the moral thing and make it illegal, those that persue the illegal route eventually get punished.

Same should go for video games, make it illegal to cheat. That may make it more desirable I hear you say, perhaps, but it would clean out a lot of the cheats before they get online, one less potential online cheat makes for a better online experience.
Glix 11th October 2010, 23:13 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominatorbuster
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glix
You talk rot.

For some people, they just want to progress in a game. This is single player ONLY. Stats and rankings for completing the single player? Get a life if you actually care about those.

/godmode on

From a psychological point what I wrote is spot on, clearly above your intelligence for you to truly understand, maybe I should I should have put a few lol's and rofl's to reach your level.

Everyone likes to progress in a game, sometimes we get in stuck in game though and it's all too easy to fall into the cheat trap. But once you do cheat, even in single player, it's a slippery slope that leads to other bad things.

Kids today want things now, an instant fix, they're not prepared to work at it, if it's hard they look for a cheat. My generation didn't have cheats like you have today, now you have hundreds of cheat websites, hundreds of hacks. It made us more skilful because we had to work at the problem, it made us better people on a moral level.

Oh superior are we now?

You do realise your comparing apples to bananas here. Your pontificating to show off but really it's just a brain fart.

Your generation? Now which generation would that be, before the Amiga?
Krayzie_B.o.n.e. 11th October 2010, 23:39 Quote
100% Total DICK move on behalf of Blizzard and Blizzard hsould be ashamed and apologize.

It's Single player and is not effecting anyone. If it was multiplayer then yeh drop the hammer on them but single player? single player? we talking bout single player?

I'm sure "Gm0ney" is getting himself a non ban-able copy of SCII right about now. After shelling out $60 I would.

Video game achievements are totally juvenile anyway, go outside, play a sport and win a trophy which leads to a million dollar contract and a supermodel wife, that's an achievement.

This move totally smells of Bobby Kotick.
Krikkit 11th October 2010, 23:43 Quote
Keep it nice ladies, or there will be consequences.

Dominatorburster: There's no need to insult everyone just because they disagree with you. I cheat in SP games for fun, would I EVER cheat in a multiplayer that wasn't a joke LAN? No. I wouldn't even think of it.

Does their system for detecting cheating include file modification? If so won't that stifle the mod community for the game too? Perhaps a double-whammy.
Krayzie_B.o.n.e. 11th October 2010, 23:53 Quote
LOL what sad comedy. just read Dominatorbuster and Supermonkey post.

People advance to harder drugs because here in America you got to be high to live in this country and because there is a drug store on EVERY corner, sometimes two drugstores on the same corner.
Whindog 12th October 2010, 00:11 Quote
SP cheaters......GTFO

MP Cheraters........Go to hell

U can question legality all you want its in the EULA, u dont like it dont buy it. This game will be around for a very long time and those impetulant imbesiles that cheat....your money is not needed. If it means a better gameing experiance for all the proper gamers then im all for it.

You tick that accept box on the EULA you get what you get coming.

Great game, great experiance. Ppl that cant accept that they suck at it will cheat so they can say there decent. It a hard, complex game that requires vast knoledge, experiance and brains........When you lose to someone who cheats youll understand that it takes away everything the game is about..... Community competetivness and enjoyment.

You dont like it, take your money elsewhere trolls. Yes they could have given more forewarning about doing this so ppl could stop, but really.........

If your going to cheat the SC2 community dosnt want anything to do with you. Go play some midless shooter.....but youll prob need to cheat in that aswell.

Offline mode is there...........Use it if you want to. But understand that cheating wont allow you to acheive anything.

Have a nice life!
MaverickWill 12th October 2010, 00:42 Quote
The amazing part is Blizzard said "We're not going to stand for cheaters", and people are getting annoyed because they're living up to their word? Single-player offline cheating, I don't have much of a problem with, but as soon as you're logged on, you SHOULD be keeping it clean. If Blizzard can't detect the difference between single-player and multi-player, boo hoo. They should have to spend ages writing a whole new detection system because you couldn't be bothered to unplug a cable, or click a couple of buttons.

The upset, I sympathise with, but don't support. The entitlement? Get lost.
Tulatin 12th October 2010, 00:45 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whindog
SP cheaters......GTFO

MP Cheraters........Go to hell

U can question legality all you want its in the EULA, u dont like it dont buy it. This game will be around for a very long time and those impetulant imbesiles that cheat....your money is not needed. If it means a better gameing experiance for all the proper gamers then im all for it.

You tick that accept box on the EULA you get what you get coming.

Great game, great experiance. Ppl that cant accept that they suck at it will cheat so they can say there decent. It a hard, complex game that requires vast knoledge, experiance and brains........When you lose to someone who cheats youll understand that it takes away everything the game is about..... Community competetivness and enjoyment.

You dont like it, take your money elsewhere trolls. Yes they could have given more forewarning about doing this so ppl could stop, but really.........

If your going to cheat the SC2 community dosnt want anything to do with you. Go play some midless shooter.....but youll prob need to cheat in that aswell.

Offline mode is there...........Use it if you want to. But understand that cheating wont allow you to acheive anything.

Have a nice life!

Between your inability to articulately communicate, and your frothing hatred lacking much in terms of base, but carrying much in bias, I think it's safe for us to discount your input entirely.
dark_avenger 12th October 2010, 00:53 Quote
There is plenty of in game cheats that disable the achievements for the game, anybody who is using third party cheats is using them to get achievements without actually getting them.

If they wanna use cheats, use the ones that are already in the game then it truly does only affect them.
LordPyrinc 12th October 2010, 00:55 Quote
Banning is a bit severe. If Blizzard is concerned with cheaters stacking their achievement points then I suggest they dock their points instead. Use a system similar to NASCAR, you don't take the win away, but you reduce the player's earned points.

I don't like using cheats and I definitely think multiplayer cheaters should be banned, but...

Using cheats in single-player games can be fun sometimes. Cheats can be used like a sandbox mode that allow you to test out different strategies and unit types without having to grind through the resource collection as one example.
jrs77 12th October 2010, 01:14 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordPyrinc
Banning is a bit severe. If Blizzard is concerned with cheaters stacking their achievement points then I suggest they dock their points instead. Use a system similar to NASCAR, you don't take the win away, but you reduce the player's earned points.

I don't like using cheats and I definitely think multiplayer cheaters should be banned, but...

Using cheats in single-player games can be fun sometimes. Cheats can be used like a sandbox mode that allow you to test out different strategies and unit types without having to grind through the resource collection as one example.

That's exactly the case in SC2. You can play offline and cheat as much as you want without Blizzard doing anything.

The ban was given for cheating while playing online, where you get achievements in the game-stats for single-player-stuff.

Alot of people might say that those achievements are of no interest, but they're actually of interest within the hardcore SC2-community, so it's only understandable that Blizzard has taken action here.

SC2-achievements -> http://starcraft.wikia.com/wiki/Achievements

This is stuff, what people are proud of, and the hardcore-community wants Blizzard to take action against those, who are cheating this system.

Everyone who has played StarCraft for extended periods of time, being active in the community knows this.
general22 12th October 2010, 01:29 Quote
Achievements, srs business.
ZERO <ibis> 12th October 2010, 01:37 Quote
Does Blizzard get the srs business achievement!?
supermonkey 12th October 2010, 05:02 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominatorbuster
I would say making cannabis legal is what invites users onto harder things, if it's legal then you could say the drug loses it's appeal. So what do you do? Make the harder drugs legal? No of course not, you do the moral thing and make it illegal, those that persue the illegal route eventually get punished.
That is not true, as was shown with Prohibition in the US. Placing alcohol into the criminal realm caused several things to happen: 1. Mafia groups and organized crime in general flourished; 2. Anyone who wanted a drink now had to join the criminal ranks; 3. Alcoholic beverages suddenly were unregulated, and as a result, could not be guaranteed to not cause adverse health effects.

Legalizing it not only keeps it cleaner, but it also removes the criminal element, and therefore some of the stigma attached to it. At that point it becomes no worse than beer.

At the end of your reply you suggested that it should be illegal to cheat in a single player game. You cited the "slippery slope" argument to prove your case, but I don't see any kind of evidence to back up your claim. Can you provide any evidence to show that cheating in a single player game causes an individual to become unhinged later in life.

I'm curious. What, in your opinion, constitutes cheating; how far are you taking this? Is your definition limited to hacks and mods to improve game play, or do you also include using the warp whistle in Super Mario Brothers 3? Cheating in single player games has been around for as long as there have been single player games. We have it easy today because there are so many resources available to us if we choose. Before the web, we had Nintendo Power. Before that, we had dedicated strategy guides and walkthroughs. We've had them since before King's Quest 1. By your logic, the world should have gone down the toilet by now.

Then again, maybe you're on to something.
stormsavant 12th October 2010, 05:28 Quote
Perhaps all of you need to reread the article here. This article is stating that Single Players are using THIRD PARTY methods to cheat in this game.

Let's set a few things straight here for those of us who ACTUALLY OWN the game.

Achievements have a purpose. They are a motivation. They keep players playing the game because people want to earn them. Don't question their relevance, if you think they are useless or stupid, that's your opinion. But they do keep players playing.

You CAN cheat in Single Player, but you USE the cheats provided WITHIN the game. You have never lost the ability to progress in the campaign any way you choose, even if it is by cheating means, HOWEVER, doing so turns achievement gains OFF.

This is important to note, because it does state in MOST EULA agreements that the use of third party programs that can create conflicts of interest in the purpose of the game and all its interactions is a violation.

If you want to cheat, that's your business if you're doing it in Single Player. By all means, cheat using the cheats provided in the game. Here. IGN even provides you with all the cheating information you need that is BUILT into the game so that you can progress however you please:

http://cheats.ign.com/ob2/068/850/850126.html

The difference is, those using third party cheating methods are still gaining their achievements while those cheating using the games rules are not. So you tell me how it is fair that I EARN my achievements playing the game normally, and those cheating using THIRD PARTY methods are allowed to earn them all the same?
fluxtatic 12th October 2010, 06:12 Quote
Thank you, supermonkey, for getting it right. DominatorBuster, how many people smoke weed that don't end up hooked on heroin? The 'gateway drug' argument is pure fallacy, as any credible drug study would show, if you cared to actually fact-check your arguments. And morality arguments are incredibly stupid. In 1916, alcohol was morally fine. Come 1920, it's the devil's own. Then come 1933, and it's fine again. Virtually all illegal drugs now have the same sort of history, minus the realization that prohibition doesn't work. The US has wasted countless billions on the war on drugs and has nothing to show for it. Look it up and tell me I'm wrong.

Now, as to SCII, I find it ridiculous, unfair, etc. However, as Blizzard pointed out, you agreed to the EULA and all that came with it. Maybe this points to the larger problem of EULAs themselves?

Same as krikkit and some others, I sometimes cheat in SP games, just for fun. I would never cheat in MP, because I'm not that much of a troll *$$hole. I'm not 13 anymore, so that sort of 'achievement' is very empty now.

Blizzard apparently made clear there no-tolerance sort of stance, so even the SP cheaters were taking there chances. If people really want this sort of thing to change, there has to be a revolt against this sort of policy on Blizzard's part. Even for myself I found the copy-protection schemes on GTA4 repugnant, but just the same I installed all that ridiculous BS because I wanted to play it that badly (after a long marathon of straight through VC and SA immediately before.) I wouldn't again, though, The last thing I want is more crap cluttering my computer and potentially phoning home to...anybody, really. Aside from the potential security holes it may be opening up, along with the idea that the studios take my money and treat me like a thief anyway. You don't like it? Make noise. Bury the studios under e-mails protesting this kind of treatment. More importantly: don't buy the games.
JA12 12th October 2010, 08:18 Quote
Haha. These comments have taken the discussion almost completely to the pointless category. Excellent! I'm in :D
Quote:
Originally Posted by fluxtatic
... The 'gateway drug' argument is pure fallacy, as any credible drug study would show, if you cared to actually fact-check your arguments...
Any credible drug study? Netherlands isin't enough? :D

For the subject itself... Singleplayer mode should be completely offline, and I mean from installation or whatever to the point when player decides to play multiplayer. And cheating in singleplayer mode a bad thing or even immoral? Sure, if you live in some kind of bubble and judge every move you make. "Oh my god, I cut roots off of this plant, does this mean I have unsolved issues from my childhood". If so, it's completely acceptable that you didn't think of that singleplayer mode loses its shine and cheats (which usually are build in the game) can actually add value.

I'm more concerned this being an issue in the first place. No, just kidding. I don't even play nowadays :D
eddtox 12th October 2010, 09:22 Quote
Sometimes, if I really enjoyed a game on the first play-through, I like to go back and play it again using tips, tricks strategy guides and, yes, even cheats. I paid for the game, I enjoyed it, and I am trying to discover all the additional content hidden throughout the game without sinking 400 hours into it. What exactly gives a company the right to prevent me from playing the game? I'd like to see them try, I will do a chargeback sooner than I can say "Suck my b*lls"

@Dominatorbuster:
Your prejudice astounds me. You should be ashamed of yourself. That a grown man ( I presume from your posts) can spout such utter rubbish without any factual basis is far more worrying than any number of 13-year-olds cheating in a game.

We can carry on the discussion if/when you start providing some factual and/or logical basis for your statements, rather that just reciting what the Daily Mail brigade has drummed into you.

P.S:I was probably no older than 11 when I first started playing computer games and using cheats. If you feel that knowledge is enough for you to make a character judgement of me, please go ahead - post it for all to see.
Daedelus 12th October 2010, 10:26 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominatorbuster
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glix
You talk rot.

For some people, they just want to progress in a game. This is single player ONLY. Stats and rankings for completing the single player? Get a life if you actually care about those.

/godmode on

From a psychological point what I wrote is spot on, clearly above your intelligence for you to truly understand, maybe I should I should have put a few lol's and rofl's to reach your level.

You used the 'cannabis is a gateway drug' argument which is fallacious. It isn't.
You resort to insults, yet the reply to your post did not insult you. You lose.
Daedelus 12th October 2010, 10:28 Quote
Oh yeah, whoever tried to equate cheating in games to drug use.....not even close to being an analogy.
MaverickWill 12th October 2010, 10:35 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daedelus
You used the 'cannabis is a gateway drug' argument which is fallacious. It isn't.
You resort to insults, yet the reply to your post did not insult you. You lose.

HANDBAGS!

Can you lot not have conflicting opinions without this turning into a playground? More importantly, why derail it with a drugs argument? Take the arguments somewhere private and/or relevant.

People who just straight cheat online (be it for rank/achievements/trolling Battle.net) are dickish. People who want to mess with the game for fun are having fun, but should be aware they need to turn off their network card first. People who want to mod the game using trainers are the cool kids. ;)

I bet Lee Harvey Oswald never cheated at Starcraft 2, and he turned out to be just fine... ¬_¬
impar 12th October 2010, 11:17 Quote
Greetings!
Quote:
Originally Posted by dark_avenger
There is plenty of in game cheats that disable the achievements for the game, anybody who is using third party cheats is using them to get achievements without actually getting them.
THIS!

The article is just wrong.
Blizzard is not banning for cheating, it is banning for hacking the game.
Whoever wants to play with large armies, try crazy things, etc already has the built-in cheats and the map editor.
Those... "players" were banned for hacking the game to get the achievements.

Perfectly justified.
However I would just remove all achievements gathered, not ban them.
dyzophoria 12th October 2010, 13:12 Quote
lol, it makes sense, The achievement points are displayed and ranked online, want to use a trainer? do it on a illegal copy, rather than messing up the ranks.
AshT 12th October 2010, 13:19 Quote
You know how it goes, first some puff then it's crack. Ban them at single player before they take their cheating to multiplayer!!!!

;)
liratheal 12th October 2010, 14:56 Quote
Cheating is just.. Meh.

I consider myself to be an average player of most games. Except fighting games, I'm very much sub par for those.

Even I, in all my average-y glory picked up the Kerrigan avatar in SC2. I've not, however, managed to stomach sitting through all those news reports to get the reporters avatar.. Don't know how anyone's managed that.

As for the legality, a trainer intercepts and modifies active game data. I didn't read SC2's EULA carefully enough to know, but I suspect that trainers are in direct violation of aforementioned EULA.

They are, legally, quite within their rights to ban away.

I don't care about cheaters. If they feel the need to cheat to be better than me, then they need to grow up. If they feel the need to cheat to be on par with me, then they need to grow up. Or I need to play less, one or the other.

<off topic>
As for the drugs argument.. Don't be a pillock. It's dependant on the person as to how the potential for addiction progresses. I know some very nice habitual users of pot, and would have known (had they not died) some less than nice habitual users of harder drugs, and they (incidentally) started with pot. I even know some, now, ex hard drug users who wouldn't touch pot with a barge pole. Even when they were on coke every day.
</off topic>
supermonkey 12th October 2010, 15:43 Quote
I guess this whole thing raises a few questions:

1. Why do we place so much value in gaming achievements? Why do you care if your neighbor cheated so that he got an extra achievement in his game? Will this actually help him get a better job later in life? Will he get a more attractive girlfriend? How exactly does this affect anyone?

2. Why are we comparing cheating in a computer game - which really is a pretty insignificant act - to drug use, which causes actual physical and chemical effects on the body? One is a personal health issue, the other is not.
Denis_iii 12th October 2010, 15:51 Quote
second dumb move by blizzard this year, impressive! seems this is what happens when you sell out.
CharlO 12th October 2010, 15:51 Quote
I heard they will also ban you if you see porn in the same pc.

Cheating is for Pussys. Pussys should die so I smile.
AshT 12th October 2010, 16:09 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by liratheal

<off topic>
As for the drugs argument.. Don't be a pillock. It's dependant on the person as to how the potential for addiction progresses. I know some very nice habitual users of pot, and would have known (had they not died) some less than nice habitual users of harder drugs, and they (incidentally) started with pot. I even know some, now, ex hard drug users who wouldn't touch pot with a barge pole. Even when they were on coke every day.
</off topic>

Get a sense of humour?
Tulatin 12th October 2010, 16:19 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by stormsavant
Perhaps all of you need to reread the article here. This article is stating that Single Players are using THIRD PARTY methods to cheat in this game.

Let's set a few things straight here for those of us who ACTUALLY OWN the game.

Achievements have a purpose. They are a motivation. They keep players playing the game because people want to earn them. Don't question their relevance, if you think they are useless or stupid, that's your opinion. But they do keep players playing.

In the context of gaming, I find this idea laughable. I don't mean to insult you, but really? If the only thing a game has to keep people playing it are the achievements, then there is something seriously wrong with that game.

Do you know why I invested 400 hours in Oblivion, 200 hours in Fallout 3? Not because I was going for silly achievements. It was because I enjoyed myself. I don't go out of my way to keep playing games just to get Achievements. If they're something a little different I'd do along the way, then I'd do it to get them. But in terms of absolutely ridiculous things like Mafia 2's DLC Achievement - drive 1,000 miles? To hell with that.

I honestly don't understand why gamers should be "Motivated" to continue playing. For what, a meaningless score, e-peen, or something to look on with pride, saying that you kept playing this dreadful piece of crap for weeks after you lost interest, just so you could get the gold merit badge of sperg?

No thank you.

I'm personally a fan of games which reward you with achievements for accomplishment, and completion. An achievement for beating the game on it's hardest, or collecting every little widget in the land is fine by me, because it's something I can do on another play through. There, it's not a motivation, it's just something for me to keep in mind, almost a box to check as I go along.

What I really don't agree with is first forcing achievements onto people with your game, and then banning them when they cheat, and these come about. People have the right to play the game however the hell they like. With whatever modifications they like. I don't think that if you're bad at a game, you should be forced to spend some hours to get good at it before you keep playing. If you want to cheat, and it's in a single player context, you should be free to.

Besides, since when did gaming become such a serious thing? I thought it was for entertainment, not work.
liratheal 12th October 2010, 17:19 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by AshT
Get a sense of humour?

..Excuse me?
whamio 12th October 2010, 20:18 Quote
Bravo Bravo...Thanks for leading the way
whamio 12th October 2010, 20:20 Quote
Bravo

thanks Blizzard for leading the way!
supermonkey 12th October 2010, 21:25 Quote
Did anyone else see that reply and immediately think that CK was back? Anyone, brothers?
1-0-1 13th October 2010, 07:11 Quote
Well cheating is cheating. Most People that go through the effort in cheating in the single player mode (laughable) will have no problem, if push comes to shove and their e-peen needs some growing, to cheat in multiplayer. And if some of the players do not like the achievement systems why bother cheating to get the achievements ?!

Maybe I am seeing this wrong, but for me achievements was about the best thing that could have happened to basic gameplaying mechanics (sure some of the them are utterly mundane). I see the achievements as a meta-game which a lot of times helps me further improve my gameplay and are challanging, fun and generally add another nice flair to the game.
Elledan 13th October 2010, 07:30 Quote
Okay, who truly cares about achievements, and why in the world are there achievements and similar for single player? That's just bizarre.

It's my game. I can do with it whatever I want as long as I don't inconvenience someone else. Blizzard screwed up by adding online fluff to single player.
impar 13th October 2010, 10:41 Quote
Greetings!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elledan
Okay, who truly cares about achievements, ...
Those who hacked the game to get them cared about them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elledan
... and why in the world are there achievements and similar for single player? That's just bizarre.
Where have you been the last years? Achievements are part of the gaming experience for quite a few years now, both on SP as in MP.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elledan
I can do with it whatever I want as long as I don't inconvenience someone else.
Well, if you hack your game to get the achievements you dont seem to care about, you inconvenience me. I dont hack and I care about the achievements.
Elledan 13th October 2010, 12:08 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by impar
Greetings!

Those who hacked the game to get them cared about them.
There should not be achievements for single player games, but maybe that's just the old-fashioned gamer in me talking and I don't get the XBox generation :)
Quote:
Where have you been the last years? Achievements are part of the gaming experience for quite a few years now, both on SP as in MP.
Stuck playing PC, SNES, N64, Wii and DS games. No achievements there except on a few rare PC games.
Quote:
Well, if you hack your game to get the achievements you dont seem to care about, you inconvenience me. I dont hack and I care about the achievements.

I wish they'd allow one to enable these achievements, having them default to disabled or so. What do I care what strangers think about how well I can (apparently) play a game? :)
impar 13th October 2010, 13:17 Quote
Greetings!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elledan
There should not be achievements for single player games, ...
Why no achievements for SP?
They are optional, you can go hunt them or not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elledan
What do I care what strangers think about how well I can (apparently) play a game? :)
Dont know. You tell me... ;)
SMIFFYDUDE 13th October 2010, 19:12 Quote
Why does everyone think that all people who use cheats in sp games are doing so for achievements or to get through the game. When i've used them I use them just to mess about, like nailing Combine soldiers to the ceiling with crossbow in HL2 or creating dozens of Nali in Unreal and blowing them all up with the Eightball. And can people stop inventing statistics to suit their arguments.
duilaws 13th October 2010, 19:38 Quote
I agree with robots. Poor rollout strategies.
impar 13th October 2010, 19:53 Quote
Greetings!
Quote:
Originally Posted by SMIFFYDUDE
Why does everyone think that all people who use cheats in sp games are doing so for achievements or to get through the game. When i've used them I use them just to mess about, like nailing Combine soldiers to the ceiling with crossbow in HL2 or creating dozens of Nali in Unreal and blowing them all up with the Eightball. And can people stop inventing statistics to suit their arguments.
You can do all of that with the regular cheat codes and map editor, of course you dont get the achievements. You dont need to hack the game to do it AND get the achievements.
FelixTech 13th October 2010, 20:09 Quote
First, to all of the people who are here discussing the impact on achievements, I would like to point that Blizzard could just as easily TAKE THEIR ACHIEVEMENTS AWAY rather than banning them. Punishment to fit the crime no? As it stands anyone willing to play something else for a while can cheat to get the achievements, get banned, and walk away with 9000+ achievement points.

Also, Blizzard do not provide any way for players to play in offline mode by choice, so they cannot justly complain about people playing in online mode. (Disabling things in windows is irrelevant to the argument, for all they know your network card is hard wired to ON).
eddtox 13th October 2010, 21:03 Quote
May I point out that I don't consider disabling my network card a reasonable expectation.
ZERO <ibis> 14th October 2010, 04:21 Quote
According to them:
Quote:
We are not banning players for using single-player cheats.

The confusion all comes from an inaccurate statement that we think cheating in single player negatively affects achievements or some such. Not the case. I don't even know if the person who this story is based on actually got banned, but if they did, it's because they were using a hack inside a multiplayer game.

I would recommend that if you want to cheat in single player StarCraft II games, use the ones we put in there. A lot of the hacks out there work in both single and multi. If you get a third party hack and intend to only use it for single player, and then go play a mutiplayer game with it still on, you're bound to get tagged.

http://forums.battle.net/thread.html?topicId=27189089534&pageNo=2#25
impar 14th October 2010, 10:33 Quote
Greetings!

So it turns out the cheater would be also cheating in MP.
MaverickWill 14th October 2010, 11:23 Quote
From the battle.net link above:

Not necessarily cheating in multiplayer, but they'd still have the trainer active in multiplayer. Which is detectable.

At least, that's how I interepreted it. It's like walking in to an exam with the answers written on your arms. Just because you don't use them, doesn't mean they're not there.
impar 14th October 2010, 11:29 Quote
Greetings!

And considering that what made Starcraft was the competitive online play, any threat to a fair MP experience must be dealt with immediately.
Ape 14th October 2010, 12:07 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by FelixTech
I would like to point that Blizzard could just as easily TAKE THEIR ACHIEVEMENTS AWAY rather than banning them. Punishment to fit the crime no?

Actually, no.

That doesn't punish anyone at all. All it says is "naughty!", takes away the users falsely obtained stats and then leaves them free to do it again when a new way is released.
GravitySmacked 14th October 2010, 14:23 Quote
I can't believe they're banning people who cheat in the SP, ridiculous.

edit: forget that just read Zero's post.
impar 17th October 2010, 19:34 Quote
Greetings!
Quote:
Blizzard Suing Starcraft II Cheat Makers
...
The three men - "Permaphrost," "Cranix," and "Linuxawesome" - are being accused of "multiple counts of copyright infringement", with Blizzard seeking not just damages but also a cut of the money the three received selling the hacks. The first two are from Canada, the third, Peru.

They also stand accused of encouraging others to infringe upon Blizzard's copyright, because "When users of the Hacks download, install, and use the Hacks, they copy StarCraft II copyrighted content into their computer's RAM in excess of the scope of their limited license, as set forth in the EULA and ToU, and create derivative works of StarCraft II."

Despite the overseas location of the three men, the case will be heard in a Los Angeles US District Court, as stated in the game's Starcraft II's end-user license.

Pwned!
eddtox 17th October 2010, 19:42 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by impar
/snip
What a load of crap.
impar 17th October 2010, 21:07 Quote
Greetings!
Quote:
Originally Posted by eddtox
What a load of crap.
Nah! Is just the real world teaching some kids.
Zider 11th March 2011, 16:01 Quote
Cheating is also utterly ridiculous.. :P
RonnyRulz 13th March 2011, 16:55 Quote
This is going too far.

Also, EULA's are a joke. No one reads them, nor do I "sign" anything or agree when I click 'okay'.
Just because I click a button which is forced on me to play a game which I paid for, does it mean they can take away my game.

I've challenged charges on my credit card, AND WON, over MMORPG's who ban me before my PAID month is up. If they want to take away my game time which I PAID for, then I will take away my money which I gave them, because they failed to deliver the product I paid for.

It's all a part of the EULA, which doesn't state they can steal your money. They can ban me from a MMORPG for an action I do, but they can't steal my $15. And yes, if I pay for 1 month of game time for $15, and they give me even 1 day less than that 1 month, then I am entitled to my $15 back, and I've never lost. I am not alone either, as thousands of others do the same.
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