Psystar has attracted Apple's attention with the sale of unauthorised 'Hackintosh' systems running MacOS X.

Psystar has attracted Apple's attention with the sale of unauthorised 'Hackintosh' systems running MacOS X.

Those of you hoping to get a Mac on the cheap may have reduced options in the future, with mainstream Hackintosh distributor Psystar facing Apple's legal might in the courtroom.

Psystar quietly introduced itself at the start of this year, offering off-the-shelf Intel-based PCs hacked to run Apple's popular MacOS X operating system. While the OS included with the so-called Open Computing units was legitimate – being a fully-shrink-wrapped retail version aimed at Mac owners who want to upgrade to the latest version – the installation was not, as it contravened the terms and conditions set out in Apple's end-user license agreement. The company later added insult to injury by offering rack-mountable servers which directly compete with Apple's extremely expensive Xserve range.

While people expressed major doubts as to the legitimacy of Psystar's business venture, everyone was pretty surprised when the units actually started shipping – and even more that they worked. The astonishment was complete when Apple completely failed to punish the brash young upstarts, with nary a complaint being heard – despite the entire venture underlining a cost differential between Apple Intel units and generic Intel units that many felt was an unfair holdover from the PowerPC days. With a bottom-end Psystar Open Computer – originally titled the OpenMac – going for $555, and an official Mac Mini of similar specification hitting $900, it's hard not to notice that something doesn't add up over in Cupertino.

It would appear that Apple's legal team has finally woken up, however: Betanews has revealed that Psystar is being sued for copyright infringement as a result of its rather shady activities. Scheduled for the 22nd of October, the suit will progress in the US District Court in Northern California with Judge James Larson presiding. Although neither Apple nor Psystar were willing to comment, it's hard to predict anything other than a victory for the company with the deepest pockets – and a loss for any end-users hoping to run MacOS X on generic hardware.

Do you believe Psystar was sailing too close to the wind with their commercial Hackintosh, or is Apple playing the bully in order to protect their unfair hardware profit margins? Share your thoughts over in the forums.
Quote cjoyce1980 16th July 2008, 11:01
thanks for that, i've just ordered my very own cheap mac....:)
Quote BlackMage23 16th July 2008, 11:11
Well it was only a matter of time beofre this happend.
Psystar should release any software and drivers they made to the public as we all know where this court case is going.
Quote cjoyce1980 16th July 2008, 11:13
OpenPro Computer
Memory: 8GB DDR2 RAM
Processor: Core2Quad/2.6GHz Q9450
Hard Drive: 150GB 10000RPM SATA
Video Card: GeForce 8800GT 512MB
Case: Black
Operating System: OS X 10.5 Leopard
Wireless PCI Express N Card: Included
Extra Optical Drive: DVD+/-RW
Additional Hard Drive #1: 750GB 7200RPM SATA
Power Supply: 600W Standard

This only cost a 1/3 (a third... yes that right!) for identical apple macPro version.

apple should be sued for monopoly, like microsoft has been time and time again
Quote Arkanrais 16th July 2008, 11:48
yeah, it's pbvious mac just want to keep their hardware hiked up by 200% cost. I've hated apple for years because of this (and their annoying as hell fanboys). hopefully mac looses and gets their ass counter sued.
Quote ChaosDefinesOrder 16th July 2008, 11:55
I really want to see a class action lawsuit against Apple for overcharging customers. 40% profit on all new hardware or it won't release it, 200% price markup on equivalent systems (then trying to legally stop the cheaper company), charging for iPod Touch firmware updates that should be free! Can you imagine if Microsoft charged £50 for Windows service packs? It's the EXACT same principle! How the hell do they get away with it?

Sure the hardware may look nice, and the GUI looks good (I don't like the way it works, but I do freely admit I'm too used to Windows and, you know, a maximise button that actually works etc...)
Quote Almightyrastus 16th July 2008, 11:56
Fair enough they have broken the license agreement with this but they are using official licensed versions of OSX and not branding the resulting pcs as Apples so where does the copyright stuff come into it?

A bit of decent competition would be good for the public.
Quote r4tch3t 16th July 2008, 12:08
I hope that Psystar wins this case and is allowed to continue offering realistic prices for the hardware. I would never use a mac, somewhat due to the price, but I can see a lot more people who would benefit from OSX using it as the prohibitive cost would be gone.
Quote Joeymac 16th July 2008, 12:27
I can't see how Apple could win this... or at least why the law wouldn't side with Psystar. Essentially they are selling PC's with custom bios (EFI or whatever it's called), that correct? All Apple can do is not support the users who run OSX on that hardware. They have no business making demands on anything else.. even then, as has been said above, they should be forced to offer that support because of the anti-competitive closed business/system they run.

If I could install OSX on my G33/Q6600 system I would go and buy it today. Sadly they don't want my money. Considering Apple don't make cheap tower systems and the mini seems neglected, I don't think it would affect their hardware sales. The kind of people who buy macs would still get them, even if they could use any hardware they want. If Jobs had the balls he would split the company to do software and hardware. With most people disenfranchised with Microsoft's offerings, there's a killing to be made by a new OS entering the market.
Quote deltaworld 16th July 2008, 12:40
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joeymac
If I could install OSX on my G33/Q6600 system I would go and buy it today.

You can run OSX on your system you just need to get iATKOS or Kalway. Obviously downloading the torrents and using these without purchasing the license is illegal but there is nothing wrong with downloading them and then buying the license from the Mac Store which therefore makes you legal.

In the terms and conditions of the End-User License Agreement for the operating system, it states that this may only be used on an Apple "Branded" machine and NOT manufactured. So there is a loophole in this where all you would need is stick an "Apple" logo on your PC and you are covered.

But again this is a bit shady and who knows, Apple might decide to take you to court over this and say it is infringement of copyright.

I haven't tried the iATKOs or Kalway mods for running it on a PC. I have heard it is possible but it is a pain to setup.

Anyone here has run or is running iATKOS or Kalway on their pc?
Quote Joeymac 16th July 2008, 13:41
Oh sure, I know I could shoe-horn OSX on it, but that would require a lot of effort as far as I can tell. Also keeping it updated would be a real pain and I wouldn't feel comfortable with using it as a primary OS. Plus I know that some stuff wouldn't work properly and so on... To tool around a hackintosh would be interesting but it's more trouble than it's worth for everyday use.
What I want is Apple just to sell it properly.
Quote 1ad7 16th July 2008, 15:16
Wow this really could end up being a huge court case. Although its very likely apple will win, if I had idk 300 million dollars I would pay for Psystar's legal cost and hope that I could beat apple. This could be spun into a antitrust lawsuit easily therefore rocketing Psystar to some huge profits :) but then again if apple is a monopoly.... then what is Microsoft.....
Quote Joeymac 16th July 2008, 15:31
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1ad7
but then again if apple is a monopoly.... then what is Microsoft.....

... a monopoly.. just one which would get it's ass handed to it if it were to work the same way as Apple.
Quote cjoyce1980 16th July 2008, 15:36
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1ad7
but then again if apple is a monopoly.... then what is Microsoft.....

there both monopolies, but microsoft has been sued so many times, so now that it plays ball.

this would be a first for apple, and the courts cant go back on there previous judgements. so if there have made microsoft play ball its about time apple did, but i hope they get screwed.

i'm pretty sure that the courts dont want to give microsoft a dam good reason to claim millions of the lost pennies back
Quote Vash-HT 16th July 2008, 17:46
I read on another site that Apple is also demanding that all the shipped units be recalled as well. Talk about control freaks...
Quote Dreaming 16th July 2008, 17:51
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vash-HT
I read on another site that Apple is also demanding that all the shipped units be recalled as well. Talk about control freaks...

I wish I had a psystar unit just so I could send a nice '**** off' letter to Apple :)
Quote Lynx 16th July 2008, 18:08
Quote:
Originally Posted by Almightyrastus
Fair enough they have broken the license agreement with this but they are using official licensed versions of OSX and not branding the resulting pcs as Apples so where does the copyright stuff come into it?

A bit of decent competition would be good for the public.

Its not the EULA which is getting psystar into trouble. EULA's have never been tested in court. Its distributing a modified version of OSX which is going to make this court case a walk over. If they hadn't modified OSX then it would be a much more interesting case.
Quote shomann 16th July 2008, 18:41
What's funny to me is how quickly everyone wants Apple to get a spanking. LOL

Look, if this company Psystar modified part of someone else's property, in the case Apple's, then they should get sued or at least made to cease/desist.

This space was GOING to be my rebuttal for the Macs are too expensive, but before I clicked the almighty Submit Reply button I actually paper-assembled a comparable rig. Woah, Apple IS about 200% more expensive, and that's with a workstation level motherboard (Tyan), 2 Quad Xeon Processors, and a Lian-Li case (style points).

Oh well, when you make your living on the machine, it's worth it to have it "just work".
Quote Icy EyeG 16th July 2008, 20:20
Quote:
Originally Posted by shomann
Woah, Apple IS about 200% more expensive, and that's with a workstation level motherboard (Tyan), 2 Quad Xeon Processors, and a Lian-Li case (style points).

That's why Apple needs to get a spanking. :D
Quote:
Originally Posted by shomann
Oh well, when you make your living on the machine, it's worth it to have it "just work".

Even so... I think is way too expensive. :(
Quote shomann 16th July 2008, 21:07
Quote:
Originally Posted by Icy EyeG
That's why Apple needs to get a spanking. :D

Even so... I think is way too expensive. :(

It's anecdotal in the extreme, but after administering and using over 30 Macs, I can tell you firsthand that their failure rate is VERY low. There is a reason for Mac fandom.

I guess what I was saying is that let's spank Apple for the right reasons. This particular deal with Psystar isn't it.
Quote D3s3rt_F0x 16th July 2008, 22:01
People say Microsoft are right to be shafted by the EU what about Apple....I know no one buys em but come on lol
Quote Icy EyeG 16th July 2008, 23:05
Quote:
Originally Posted by shomann
It's anecdotal in the extreme, but after administering and using over 30 Macs, I can tell you firsthand that their failure rate is VERY low. There is a reason for Mac fandom.

I don't question that: It's very easy to have a very low failure rate if you have complete control over the hardware. However, Apple should give consumers the choice: premium stability for premium price (Macs) OR normal stability for a regular price (ie, normal custom PC running OSX legally). :(
Quote M4RTIN 16th July 2008, 23:10
i never really understood why microsoft got their asses kicked over including internet explorer and (i think wmp) with windows pc's yet apple includes safari and quicktime and forces you to use apple software out of the box. just because apple has a much smaller market share doesnt make it right.
Quote impar 16th July 2008, 23:10
Greetings!
Quote:
Originally Posted by D3s3rt_F0x
People say Microsoft are right to be shafted by the EU what about Apple....
Apple has very low market share.
Quote shomann 16th July 2008, 23:16
Quote:
Originally Posted by Icy EyeG
I don't question that: It's very easy to have a very low failure rate if you have complete control over the hardware. However, Apple should give consumers the choice: premium stability for premium price (Macs) OR normal stability for a regular price (ie, normal custom PC running OSX legally). :(

Alright I can go with that. But that does mean that the majority of component manufacturers out there would have to build drivers for both Mac OSX and Windows. The entire Mac experience that enjoys tight-knit software/hardware would suffer at the hands of third party companies like Nvidia, ATI, Realtek, Intel, etc...

That said, I don't think Apple is relying on their Mac side of things for the future. They seek to dominate the media market.
Quote seebul 16th July 2008, 23:59
Sued for monopoly? Its their OS, they built/build it.. Surely they should be able to say how its used? The only way i see Apple monopolising anything is with the Itunes store and Ipod DRM etc..

And to say that this won't hold up in court is just silly, Psystar modified and distributed Apple's own software which is copyrighted. Psystar dont stand a chance in hell...
Quote BurningFeetMan 17th July 2008, 02:14
Failure rate isn't dependant on whether the hardware was produced from Apple or not. I still run all my PC hardware from the past decade +. Hell, even my Olivetti 286 was still running the day I gave it away, after 15 years.

I hope Apple get a kick in the arse. Large monopolised corporations are ****ed, no matter what they're selling.
Quote TurtlePerson2 17th July 2008, 02:52
You can't really sue Apple for being a monopoly considering that they own something like 10% of the market. If they make software than they can control which platforms it runs on. If you don't want to pay the huge premium then don't. When I bought a laptop, I thought about going Mac, but it was twice as much so I didn't. It's that simple.
Quote HourBeforeDawn 17th July 2008, 04:18
mac would do so much better if they allowed people to build their own macs and yet mac isnt sued for being a monopoly sheesh.... oh and is there a company that apple hasnt sued yet lol but I guess its the only way they really make money =p
Quote p3n 17th July 2008, 09:24
99% of these comments made up on the spot...

Really get your own opinions ladies and make sure they are actually based on facts too..
Quote ChaosDefinesOrder 17th July 2008, 09:39
Quote:
Originally Posted by seebul
Its their OS, they built/build it.. Surely they should be able to say how its used?

Um....wasn't that why Microsoft were shafted by the EU courts in the first place? Over their OS, their internet browser and their media player?

The way I interpreted the original news article is that the OS X version that Psystar are shipping is fully sealed and legitimate copies. The hacking is done on the driver level to get the hardware to work, so actually the OS itself is fully legal except for the lack of apple branding on the case? Unless I'm mistaken here, Apple are just doing a Sony and using legal might to silence a company offering a cheaper alternative to those available directly (I'm referring to Sony legally silencing the import company offering cheaper, better imports from Japan before the delayed release in Europe)

Apple may only have 10% of the overall market, but they have a 100% monopoly over the Mac OS market. Legally silencing a company that is offering a cheaper alternative to the same market IS anti-competitive tactics, and it IS showing a desire for a monopoly. A silimar thing happened with Dr Pepper - Coca Cola tried to buy it, the worldwide trade commision veto'ed it as it would have left Coca Cola with a monopoly in the fruit flavoured soda market.
Quote impar 17th July 2008, 09:49
Greetings!

Why would Apple be charged with abuse of a dominant position in the computer market?
Makes no sense.

Psystar will lose this one easily.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChaosDefinesOrder
Um....wasn't that why Microsoft were shafted by the EU courts in the first place? Over their OS, their internet browser and their media player?
No.

PS:
Have a read:
http://www.betanews.com/article/Inside_the_EU_Courts_Ruling_Microsofts_Abuse_of_Dominance/1190052315
Quote ChaosDefinesOrder 17th July 2008, 10:01
Quote:
Originally Posted by impar
Greetings!

Why would Apple be charged with abuse of a dominant position in the computer market?
Makes no sense.

Psystar will lose this one easily.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChaosDefinesOrder
Um....wasn't that why Microsoft were shafted by the EU courts in the first place? Over their OS, their internet browser and their media player?
No.

PS:
Have a read:
http://www.betanews.com/article/Inside_the_EU_Courts_Ruling_Microsofts_Abuse_of_Dominance/1190052315

Ah ok, I was mainly going on the fact that they were forced to offer a version of Windows without the Media Player and interpreted that as part of the court ruling in the first place! ho-hum

Still, with the amount that Apple overcharges for its hardware, something needs to be done to tell them it's not acceptable, unfortunately it's probably never going to happen!
Quote impar 17th July 2008, 10:45
Greetings!
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChaosDefinesOrder
Ah ok, I was mainly going on the fact that they were forced to offer a version of Windows without the Media Player and interpreted that as part of the court ruling in the first place!
That usually is the decision that gets out via media, the others, which are much more important, get lost in the ensuing debate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChaosDefinesOrder
Still, with the amount that Apple overcharges for its hardware, something needs to be done to tell them it's not acceptable, ...
I think Apple customers buy because of the lifestyle associated with Apple marketing, not the hardware.
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