Toshiba drops HD DVD - the format war is over

Author: Tim Smalley
Published: 19th February 2008
Comments (46) Stumble
Toshiba drops HD DVD - the format war is over

With Toshiba pulling out of the market, the format war is finally over - consumers can now get on and watch some HD content!

In announcement that spells the end of the high-definition format war, Toshiba said in a statement that it will no longer develop, manufacture and market HD DVD players and recorders – a decision that it says was made "following recent major changes in the market."

Ever since Warner Bros said that it was to move exclusively to Blu-ray in an announcement on the eve of the Consumer Electronics Show, it was only a matter of weeks before the format war would come to an end.

"We carefully assessed the long-term impact of continuing the so-called 'next-generation format war' and concluded that a swift decision will best help the market develop," said Atsutoshi Nishida, president and CEO of Toshiba. "While we are disappointed for the company and more importantly, for the consumer, the real mass market opportunity for high definition content remains untapped and Toshiba is both able and determined to use our talent, technology and intellectual property to make digital convergence a reality."

The company says it will begin to reduce shipments of HD DVD players and recorders and is aiming to pull out of the market completely by the end of March. In the same timeframe, Toshiba expects to end volume production of HD DVD disc drives for PCs and games (we're assuming they're talking about the Xbox 360 drive here), but it says that it "will continue to make efforts to meet customer requirements."

During a Q&A session that followed the press conference in Tokyo, he said that the company has "no plans at all" to adopt Blu-ray at the moment.

Microsoft also issued a statement yesterday evening, which said that, "We do not believe the recent reports about HD DVD will have any material impact on the Xbox 360 platform or our position in the marketplace. We will wait until we hear from Toshiba before announcing any specific plans around the Xbox 360 HD DVD player." This came in before Toshiba's announcement, but given that Toshiba has said it plans to end volume production of all HD DVD devices, it seems fairly certain that Microsoft won't be selling the Xbox 360 HD DVD player for much longer.

Are you glad that the format war has come to an end? If so, were you happy with the outcome? Let us know in the forums.
Quote kitt 19th February 2008, 10:17
Great. Now i may consider buying a player. (Blu-ray i mean)
Quote DXR_13KE 19th February 2008, 10:28
Quote:
company has "no plans at all" to adopt Blu-ray at the moment.

i feel something interesting coming...

and i see a blueray attachment on the 360...
Quote cjoyce1980 19th February 2008, 10:38
its a shame, HD-DVD was the better format for developers, a Java for Blu-Ray is a nightmare to use, over HDi. Hopefully in Blu-ray version 3, we could see a return of this development application.

you can win anything with alot of cash to buy support
Quote RTT 19th February 2008, 10:45
Boo.
Quote DeXtmL 19th February 2008, 11:04
finally....
Hope blu-ray's price can be brought down...
Quote rjkoneill 19th February 2008, 11:22
so my housemates new top end ROCK games laptop with the HDDVD as standard is now as pointless as a fridge in the arctic

oh how i will laugh when i get home

i think this may take some months to establish itself

its strange how big super markets and media stores stock a 20% BR 80% HDDVD in my area
where as in my recent trip to london i noticed the exact opposite.
Quote JK23 19th February 2008, 11:24
Damn!!! Looks like my 360 HD-DVD Drive is gonna be a paper weight now - lol... If only someone would hack the damn PS3 then I would get one of those - lol :)
Quote alextwo 19th February 2008, 11:27
:'(

Shame the better format lost. Oh well.
Quote mclean007 19th February 2008, 11:36
Sony are going to shift a LOT of PS3s over the next few weeks now that the 'wait-and-see' crowd, like me, finally commit.
Quote naokaji 19th February 2008, 11:46
Quote:
Originally Posted by mclean007
Sony are going to shift a LOT of PS3s over the next few weeks now that the 'wait-and-see' crowd, like me, finally commit.

or affordable blue ray players start to appear in significant numbers outside of japan...
Quote Flibblebot 19th February 2008, 11:50
Unfortunately, I don't think this is a case of "Hip Hip BluRay!" at all. BluRay is a standards mess, with many of the components of the standard being optional - this will mean that in a couple of years we'll be seeing cheap BluRay players only implementing part of the BluRay standard, meaning that they'll only be able to play part of the content on some discs.

Now that there's no competition, there's absolutely nothing to stop the BluRay camp (which, after all, is lead by Sony) tightening the DRM screws, enforcing region coding and ICT.

A sad day. Again, the best format loses out - but this time it isn't because of public support, it's because of corporate tactics.
Quote quack 19th February 2008, 12:27
Boo! :(

I'm glad the war is over, just a shame the wrong format won.
Quote sandys 19th February 2008, 12:48
I dunno where all this wrong formats stuff comes from but some of the stuff proposed in BDLive profile sounds great for the consumer and something the HDDVD did not offer, the ability to have a portable copy of a BD film you have purchased for one is a great move, so it'll be packed full of DRM does it actually matter to anyone bar pirates so long as it doesn't get in the way of playing a movie you've purchased? Also most films being simultaneously released kind of negates the issue of region control too.

Of course the new profiles might upset some early adopters but as with any early adoption of new tech there is always a bit of risk involved and for the most part it would just mean a few people might miss out on some features but as the hardware gets commoditized as it will it should be cheap enough to add a better player to your collection, I'd argue most early adopters knew what they were buying into and possible problems as the price of the kit was beyond an impulse purchase and would be done by the more informed.
Quote Flibblebot 19th February 2008, 13:16
Quote:
Originally Posted by sandys
Of course the new profiles might upset some early adopters but as with any early adoption of new tech there is always a bit of risk involved and for the most part it would just mean a few people might miss out on some features but as the hardware gets commoditized as it will it should be cheap enough to add a better player to your collection, I'd argue most early adopters knew what they were buying into and possible problems as the price of the kit was beyond an impulse purchase and would be done by the more informed.
But it's not just the new profiles, that's fairly easily managed with a firmware upgrade. As you say, most early adopters tend to be technical and well-informed, and I imagine most will know how to upgrade their machines.

The real problem is that there are parts of the BD spec that are apparently optional, and this doesn't just affect early adopters. It's fairly easy to see cheap players that eschew these optional parts of the spec to save money, and so we'll end up with a two-tier BluRay market: those with players that can handle all of the content on a disc, and those who can only see some of the content.

HD DVD, as a spec fully ratified by the DVD Forum, is 100% obligatory which meant that all discs would play on all players.
Quote proxess 19th February 2008, 13:47
I guess I'll continue living the next years of my life with the wonderful 4.7 metric gigabytes to store my Anime. I doubt Toshiba will take on Blu-Ray because they would just have to completely remodel their industries for the blue laser discs, while they are setup for the red laser disks.
Quote E.E.L. Ambiense 19th February 2008, 13:55
Quote:
Originally Posted by proxess
I guess I'll continue living the next years of my life with the wonderful 4.7 metric gigabytes to store my Anime. I doubt Toshiba will take on Blu-Ray because they would just have to completely remodel their industries for the blue laser discs, while they are setup for the red laser disks.

HD-DVD does use blue lasers. Red laser wavelength is inefficient for use with the higher amount of data that blue lasers can read. The reason for this is that blue has a shorter wavelength than red relative to the rest of the visible spectrum, so it suffers less from diffraction effects; resolving smaller
details/information.

It's common sense that Toshiba would have to develop some kind of player for even their home turf. Over 90% of the HD market in Japan is Blu-Ray. They will have to shut down their doors if they don't do something. Business is business.
Quote quack 19th February 2008, 14:12
Quote:
Originally Posted by sandys
I dunno where all this wrong formats stuff comes from but some of the stuff proposed in BDLive profile sounds great for the consumer and something the HDDVD did not offer, the ability to have a portable copy of a BD film you have purchased for one is a great move, so it'll be packed full of DRM does it actually matter to anyone bar pirates so long as it doesn't get in the way of playing a movie you've purchased?
DRM and region coding are always bad.
Quote mmorgue 19th February 2008, 14:13
Ok, you said you weren't going to release anything until you were sure of the formats, etc.. Well, now you are....

...Enough stalling Lucas and get your @rse in gear -- gimme my original Star Wars trilogy in 1080p!

And none of this Special Feature bollocks. I want pure, unadulterated original Star Wars!

And throw Indy in there as well.
Quote hawky84 19th February 2008, 14:29
I wonder if blue ray will stay at its current price or even go up now it has no compitition...

I personally would have prefered the format with the set in stone standard to win rather than the one the has changed its standard several times since launch. Oh well I still have a CRT TV which has an awesome picture on it anyway so no worries for me.
Quote sub routine 19th February 2008, 14:30
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

PS3 suddenly looks like a more promising format, but at the cost of all the games to date and the entire European gamer community. I for one wont be giving them my money anytime soon.

Not that I`m proffesing M$ is all about it`s peeps and love the game :D

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
Quote hawky84 19th February 2008, 14:35
Quote:
Originally Posted by mmorgue
...Enough stalling Lucas and get your @rse in gear -- gimme my original Star Wars trilogy in 1080p!

What a waste of money, you wont get much, mif any benifit from this as it wasn't shot with HD equipment. Just watch Bourne Identity on HD-DVD in 1080p and it almost looks worse than standard def DVD. Then watch Casino Royal on HD-DVD in 1080p and that looks impressive.
Quote mmorgue 19th February 2008, 14:39
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawky84
Quote:
Originally Posted by mmorgue
...Enough stalling Lucas and get your @rse in gear -- gimme my original Star Wars trilogy in 1080p!

What a waste of money, you wont get much, mif any benifit from this as it wasn't shot with HD equipment. Just watch Bourne Identity on HD-DVD in 1080p and it almost looks worse than standard def DVD. Then watch Casino Royal on HD-DVD in 1080p and that looks impressive.

Leave me to my fantasies...
Quote E.E.L. Ambiense 19th February 2008, 15:00
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawky84
What a waste of money, you wont get much, mif any benifit from this as it wasn't shot with HD equipment. Just watch Bourne Identity on HD-DVD in 1080p and it almost looks worse than standard def DVD. Then watch Casino Royal on HD-DVD in 1080p and that looks impressive.

Neither was Blade Runner, but a 4K scan and frame-by-frame restoration over a period of years and finally released on high-def, and it looks.....perfect. Absolutely perfect. Trust me, if you know what you're looking at and looking for, Star Wars will look amazing in 1080p. Being shot in 'HD' only helps. I'd take a decent 35mm mastered frame shot over some digital POS frame any day.
Quote Firehed 19th February 2008, 15:14
Figures the format with the heavier DRM would win. Which means I won't be buying, thank you very much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RTT
Boo.
Quote steveo_mcg 19th February 2008, 16:10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firehed
Figures the format with the heavier DRM would win. Which means I won't be buying, thank you very much.

Exactly what i was thinking. I'm guessing that this format won't last more than a couple of years before we have virtually all content delivered by the internet (or carrier pigeon). I suppose with that will come even more drm lock down, ah well time to dig out the VCR.
Quote mikeuk2004 19th February 2008, 16:32
I was close to getting the 360 drive at xmas for Transformers. Im glad I didnt now and got me a PS3 this month. Time to build up a Bluray collection when the prices come to £5-£10 a disc becuase £30 for a new release is just outragous.

It had to come to an end, but this feels way too soon. But they say that the adoption to HD Media has taken off quicker than the adoption to DVD. So hopefully we will see cheap Bluray films soon.
Quote ssj12 19th February 2008, 17:01
Blu-ray is the superior format.... it might have heavier DRM but oh well, the industry is still basically DRM. You can't get away from it since if you get away from it you have even worse tracking software facing you.

Blu-ray supports all codexs HD-DVD supports and had more space on a single layer. Plus HDi was limited, Java allows for a lot more innovation due to it's overall flexibility.
Quote Rocket733 19th February 2008, 17:02
Quote:
Originally Posted by steveo_mcg
Exactly what i was thinking. I'm guessing that this format won't last more than a couple of years before we have virtually all content delivered by the internet (or carrier pigeon). I suppose with that will come even more drm lock down, ah well time to dig out the VCR.

I'm all for internet delievery. I guess Sony can finally say they won a format war, it's been a while... (though I guess memorystick is still around)
Quote devdevil85 19th February 2008, 17:58
The only thing I care about for Blu-Ray is the Disc Space (50GB DualLayer!!) for Music, Photos, etc. But for watching Movies, why bother? I mean w/ my Cable Provider (Everest) I can order an HD Movie for $4.99-5.99 and can watch it for 24 hours (whether it's true Hi-Def idk, but it damn-near looks/sounds like it. That's not that much to pay, and w/o the need to buy a player or run a whole new 100ft. DVI cable to my projector for ~$200 (Only using Component atm) just to watch these movies, it's makes the most sense to just rent from the cable provider. I would think the people that can afford a BR player already have this service.....which would be IPTV, right?
Quote themax 19th February 2008, 18:07
Everyone complains about DRM and Region coding yet DVD sales continue to do well and people prefer the DRM filled DVD which are usually region coded to.....DRM fille HD that is still region coded. I fail to understand how something that was standard in the previous generation and commonly accepted is so taboo now? If you are buying your discs then the DRM is meaningless. If you plan on renting and ripping your movies then therein lies the problem and that is piracy. And if you think digital distribution is the second coming then you are naive to think those files will be as open as MP3s when you rent online from Netflix or someone like that. I can understand the arguement of those who backup physical movies though. That can be a problem with all the DRM.
Quote Flibblebot 19th February 2008, 18:28
Quote:
Originally Posted by themax
Everyone complains about DRM and Region coding yet DVD sales continue to do well and people prefer the DRM filled DVD which are usually region coded to.....DRM fille HD that is still region coded. I fail to understand how something that was standard in the previous generation and commonly accepted is so taboo now? If you are buying your discs then the DRM is meaningless. If you plan on renting and ripping your movies then therein lies the problem and that is piracy. And if you think digital distribution is the second coming then you are naive to think those files will be as open as MP3s when you rent online from Netflix or someone like that. I can understand the arguement of those who backup physical movies though. That can be a problem with all the DRM.
What about those people who rip movies for legitimate reasons, for example those people that have video jukeboxes/distributed video. As far as I'm aware, the law allows for copies of discs to be made, as long as the original disc and the copy are in the same geographic location. DRM stops people doing something which the law allows - and as such, you could argue that DRM is an infringement of our liberties.
Quote kempez 19th February 2008, 20:58
Good, it is now over and we can continue on with our lives

Blu Ray has great tech specs looks fantastic. The pS3 is a great bit of kit and DRM doesn't bother me as I always buy legitimate discs and look after them

People won't buy Sony stuff, yet they would happily buy a format "backed" by Microsoft? Not that they (MS) didn't have their own agenda, of course.

Quite frankly I don't give a damn who makes them or who licences them as long as BR Discs get cheaper so I can enjoy more high def content.

I suppose grats to Sony for finally winning a format war, glad I sold my 360 HD DVD player when every HD DVD I played on it looked shocking compared to Blu Ray
Quote ll.13 19th February 2008, 21:22
How fast does 40Gb burn onto an 8x disk? 700Mb. 24x burns on about 8-20 minutes for me. :)
Quote dire_wolf 19th February 2008, 21:30
Eh? sony won? thats some bad joo joo, feel sorry for all the people that invested in 360 drives and players. Who knows it may carry on in it's current form.
Quote johnmustrule 19th February 2008, 22:27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firehed
Figures the format with the heavier DRM would win. Which means I won't be buying, thank you very much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RTT
Boo.

I dislike DRM and all but frankly its never stopped me from downloading ___HDMOVIEHERE___ from ___NOTORIOUSFILE SHARINGAPPHERE___ or doing anything legal
Quote The_Beast 19th February 2008, 22:32
Blue-ray FTW
Quote DXR_13KE 20th February 2008, 00:05
flash memory, holographic media and internet delivery are the future....
Quote mi1stormilst 20th February 2008, 00:13
Blu-Ray is a mess and now they have no motivation to correct it. Prices for movies have been to high from both formats and now they are sure to remain high. I went HD-DVD early but was very timid about buying to many movies (10). The only positive out come to this turn of events is that I expect to purchase another HD-DVD for my 360 and get a bunch of HD-DVD movies at some GREAT prices over the next few months.
Quote sandys 20th February 2008, 00:15
Quote:
Originally Posted by DXR_13KE
flash memory, holographic media and internet delivery are the future....

Too far in the future really especially where internet delivery and the UK are considered in the same sentence, we've only just gone beyond smoke signals you know :D
Quote sandys 20th February 2008, 00:19
Quote:
Originally Posted by mi1stormilst
Prices for movies have been to high from both formats and now they are sure to remain high.

Not that high really considering the high quality and the fact you own a copy, look at the cinema these days over £50 for a family to watch a film on a multiplex screen thats getting smaller and smaller, a room thats getting brighter and brighter with a sound system that rarely sounds balanced anymore, personally I'm starting to think the better experience is had at home.
Quote woodshop 20th February 2008, 02:54
i guess this means i won't be getting my 5 free HDVD's from them... xmas gift becomes paper weight in record time.. startup and load times sucked big time anyway.
Quote E.E.L. Ambiense 20th February 2008, 02:57
Quote:
Originally Posted by mi1stormilst
Prices for movies have been to high from both formats and now they are sure to remain high.

Prices are quite low in comparison to when DVD streeted. I remember paying $40 for a non-anamorphic version of The Crow on DVD back in '97. What a joke.

Prices will drop pretty soon.
Quote leexgx 20th February 2008, 05:22
:P <Toshiba expects to end volume production of HD DVD disc drives for PCs and games>

as i have seen in alot of places no trade place even Lists them on there inventory, alot lot of posts i have seen around is alot may have been wanting an HD-dvd drive for the pc but thay only stock BR drives so most OEM or retailers only sell BR PC drives

HD-dvd only offers 6gb(or 19gb DL) more then DVD9,
BR starts at 25gb or 50gb, 16gb or 36gb more then dvd 9

at least in 5+ years we will be seeing games on BR i guess, (we be able to fit all The Sims add-on packs all onto one DL BR disk :) )
Quote HourBeforeDawn 20th February 2008, 06:36
WOOT I AM SO GLAD anyhow now that all this nonsense is overwith M$ can take their HDi and let Blu-Ray use it so that bluray can get rid of that crappy java interface. ^_^

You know M$ wont let that die they are bound to let Blu-Ray use it so they can keep making some green assuming they dont want to much for it.
Quote Zyphron 20th February 2008, 16:05
People joke about holo media and say its too far off but truth be told Digital content delivery is still not up to par to really fight off the retail sales.
Its that instant gratifcation the consumer gets from taking a 5 min trip to the store and are sitting on the couch watching a movie in under 20.
Even with Harddrives in the 1Tb sizes while granted its 40 blueray movies (25Gb's each) most people have bigger movie collections.
Ive always wondered this question if i could fit a 1080i movie (2.5hrs) under 6gb why is HD/BR needed? i know there are extra features, and im sure it has something to do with they way a computer can utilise compression algorthims. why not add in that kind of thing to a Media player?
HD-Tivo comes to mind.

I suppose something like that would make sence... and we all know how those ideas go.
Quote mikeuk2004 20th February 2008, 19:48
Well, you can now get the Xbox 360 HD-DVD drive for £65

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Xbox-360-HD-DVD-Player/dp/B000FNKQCE/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=videogames&qid=1203517967&sr=8-1

More HD DVD sales to come I guess
Log in

You are not logged in, please login with your forum account below. If you don't already have an account please register to start contributing.