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Asus GeForce GTX 1070 Strix Review

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Vault-Tec 22nd June 2016, 10:11 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Combatus
Because price-wise this isn't a straight replacement for the GTX 970 - it costs £150 more than it did at launch and Nvidia won't be releasing anything cheaper for a while. So really, it doesn't have much to lose if indeed there's still plenty GTX 970 stock kicking around - they're cheaper, yes, but they're significantly less powerful and not ideal for 4K or VR. The real issue will be with AMD's next move, which is slated to be very affordable, so that's what I'd be concerned with if I was a retailer with thousands of GTX 970s sitting on the shelves.

It is a replacement for the 970. The giveaway is the '70 part of the model number.

It's die shrunk Maxwell, so could indeed have cost less to produce than Maxwell.

If sites like this continue to recommend these products to people and don't take a stand prices will just continue to rise.

On everything but performance this card is a failure.
DbD 22nd June 2016, 10:39 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by LennyRhys
Quote:
Originally Posted by DbD
The 970 was about £260 new

In reality it was much closer to £300 for OCd vendor cards, with £260 being the absolute cheapest for vanilla stock. I paid £230 for a good overclocked 770 just before the 970 came out, and I was somewhat relieved to see the price of the 970 when it hit the shelves. But you make a good point about the 970 holding its price for a long time, which it did.

Nice performance from the 1070 and I'm sure the price will soon be very attractive for people looking to upgrade from 970/980.

Well I say £260 because that's what I got mine for 1 month after it came out (which was an o/c non vanilla card). Pricing is definitely going the wrong way as the 8800GT I bought after it came out was only £170, and while you might say the 1070 should be more expensive actually the power usage, and physical chip size are about the same and just like the 1070 it was the *budget* high end card.
rollo 22nd June 2016, 11:07 Quote
Competition leads to better prices, to say Nvidia has some at the 1070 or 1080 market segment is ludicrous at best. They will price gouge to VEGA knowing that if you want the performance on offer you have little choice.

Zen will be a deciding factor in the future of CPU and GPU pricing fail to gain market share and we will be price gouged perm.
Vault-Tec 22nd June 2016, 11:10 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by DbD
Well I say £260 because that's what I got mine for 1 month after it came out (which was an o/c non vanilla card). Pricing is definitely going the wrong way as the 8800GT I bought after it came out was only £170, and while you might say the 1070 should be more expensive actually the power usage, and physical chip size are about the same and just like the 1070 it was the *budget* high end card.

I don't see any way of buttering up a £470 price tag for a 1070 I just don't. Yes the 1070 is a massive jump in performance over the 970 and yes it's quite close to a Titan X in performance but if we look at the 970 it did exactly the same.

It was a massive leap over the 770 it was almost as fast as a Titan etc etc. It did all of the same things the 1070 does now, yet cost 1/3 less.

The worrying part is not that there are fanboys out there who will pay anything for the latest cards. The worry is that the very media who we rely on to see us right are just as caught up in all of this as any one else. Why are they not reducing the overall ratings to point this out? why are they recommending them?

This whole industry is as bent as a nine bob note. I've not seen one negative review of the 1070 or the 1080 yet. No one has dared to question Nvidia as to why they are gouging the crap out of their own users because AMD do not have a card to compete with theirs. They should be getting a roasting, not a polish.

It's all set up so perfectly. You've got Linus, Jay, etc all of those other droids doing exactly what their master tells them to do. You've got 1070s here on Bit-tech that cost nearly double what the 970 did when it launched being recommended...

Sheesh seriously this is just nuts. My head hurts just thinking about it !

But it was the same when Intel decided to increase their performance by 5%, market it as a new (and far hotter) CPU and then raise the prices. Not only that but they were also fundamentally broken because the thermal paste was junk. People were actually having to smash the things apart just to get them to behave yet not even one single negative review.

Honestly are you sh***ing me? is their control really that powerful?

What am I even saying? I've seen it first hand. We used to have an Intel rep come around the shop I worked in handing out ES like they were sweets. Only, if we ever decided to sell AMD that would all stop.

I'm not the biggest fan of capitalism myself but in all honesty the PC market is probably one of the worst examples of it I have ever come across. Even audio gear is reviewed honestly and there are plenty of stinkers on What? Hifi.

This time next year we will be looking at a grand for a small die mid range piece of silicon. I wonder whether we will still be nodding dogs then too? or will most of us not even be here because we simply won't be able to afford it?
rollo 22nd June 2016, 11:38 Quote
The later option not able to afford it. PC high end has become a very expensive hobby. Want the latest 10 core that's £1400 please makes Nvidias asking sound reasonable lol.

ZEN fails welcome to price gouge central, I'd start praying about now.
Vault-Tec 22nd June 2016, 11:45 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by rollo
The later option not able to afford it. PC high end has become a very expensive hobby. Want the latest 10 core that's £1400 please makes Nvidias asking sound reasonable lol.

ZEN fails welcome to price gouge central, I'd start praying about now.

Nothing to pray for :) if it gets any worse I will just ride this PC until it dies and then go to the consoles. Especially with performance consoles on the horizon.

I was actually fooled for a moment thinking that Intel may release the 8 core Broadwell at a price that tempted me to replace my 5820k but nope.
perplekks45 22nd June 2016, 11:59 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vault-Tec
I'm not the biggest fan of capitalism myself but in all honesty the PC market is probably one of the worst examples of it I have ever come across. Even audio gear is reviewed honestly and there are plenty of stinkers on What? Hifi.

The personal audio market is the best example for what is going to happen to the graphics card and CPU market over the next couple of years.

When I bought my first portable audio player based on sound quality and supported formats not flashy screens and features as well as my first proper headphones (2011: Cowon C2 and Grado SR125i) there were no players for more than 500 Euros (that I know of) and two pairs of headphones for over 2k Euros (Sennheiser Orpheus and Stax SR-009) around. Today the most expensive player is priced at over 4.5k Euros (A&K 380 Ltd. Edition) and there is hardly any price segment between 1k and 5k without at least two or three overlapping headphones. Hell, even universal (read: NOT custom) in-ears go up to over 3k Euros!

The 1070 presents great bang for your buck compared to its predecessors (faster than a 980Ti at a lower price) but the amount of money required to even enter this new generation is obscene. People will pay, as we have learned from the personal audio markets mentioned above. This does not mean it is okay. As long as people buy this stuff at inflated prices the prices will keep rising. And you can easily see nVidia's willingness to lower prices when looking at Massdrop's recent offers of 1070 and 1080 Founder's Edition cards for MSRP (plus shipping if you live outside the US). If even Massdrop cannot get nVidia to prepare a proper offer... well, we're screwed. ;)
Yadda 22nd June 2016, 12:09 Quote
Instead of the new range slotting into roughly the same price point as the old, this time they've cleverly created another, higher tier for the new line to slot into.

Want 1080p or 1440p (possibly) and not too bothered about VR?
Buy a AMD 480 (or last gen Nvidia 970/980)

Want higher res/frame rate or VR?
Buy a 10*0 Nvidia and bend over, bitches.


It looks like there'll be an even clearer division between the two manufacturers product lines this time. Nvidia will play Lexus at the high-value end while AMD will play Toyota at the lower end, which will minimise competition between their products even further.
Vault-Tec 22nd June 2016, 12:13 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by perplekks45
The personal audio market is the best example for what is going to happen to the graphics card and CPU market over the next couple of years.

When I bought my first portable audio player based on sound quality and supported formats not flashy screens and features as well as my first proper headphones (2011: Cowon C2 and Grado SR125i) there were no players for more than 500 Euros (that I know of) and two pairs of headphones for over 2k Euros (Sennheiser Orpheus and Stax SR-009) around. Today the most expensive player is priced at over 4.5k Euros (A&K 380 Ltd. Edition) and there is hardly any price segment between 1k and 5k without at least two or three overlapping headphones. Hell, even universal (read: NOT custom) in-ears go up to over 3k Euros!

The 1070 presents great bang for your buck compared to its predecessors (faster than a 980Ti at a lower price) but the amount of money required to even enter this new generation is obscene. People will pay, as we have learned from the personal audio markets mentioned above. This does not mean it is okay. As long as people buy this stuff at inflated prices the prices will keep rising. And you can easily see nVidia's willingness to lower prices when looking at Massdrop's recent offers of 1070 and 1080 Founder's Edition cards for MSRP (plus shipping if you live outside the US). If even Massdrop cannot get nVidia to prepare a proper offer... well, we're screwed. ;)

In the past we were far more honest. If i harp back to the Spectrum days for example demo tapes were sent to reviewers and if they were crap they were literally burned at the stake.

That was when the UK was in charge of its own software development companies and any one could enter. As soon as we moved to consoles it all became very expensive and you needed millions to invest in cartridges etc.

This only showed signs of abating over the past couple of years, where the Indie scene has risen quite sharply. Mostly because people are over paying $60 for a game.

The problem is with the state of hardware reviewers these days. None of them are blunt, none of them are sharp, none of them are hard to please. None have complained about the pricing and if they have they haven't let it affect the review score/final outcome.

The audio business in the UK is honest. Mostly because we are in full control of that and the U.S needs to please us which it seldom does. I've seen very few U.S products score highly on What? Hifi and that's mainly because for many years America didn't understand what the true meaning of Hifi was. They just tried their "Bigger is best" method and it failed on us.

We as brits can still make and sell audio products and Graham Slee is a shining example of a genuine product offered at a very reasonable price.

Computer parts reviews? well firstly you need to depend on these companies to actually give you gear to review. Then you need to be really nice to them because if you are not then they throw a sulk and you don't get any more review samples.

And that's the problem right there. He who kisses the most backside becomes the richest (look up Linus's earnings) and he who bites the hand he feeds or offers one shred of honesty gets the rough end of a pineapple.

And that's BS. Honestly? I would actually pay a sub every month to be a part of a review site who are independent and as such review products without having to rely on handouts. At least then they could be a bit more honest without being terrified that the very companies they depend on now were going to refuse them any more products.

It's because of the complete state of the "review" industry that Intel are getting away with charging £1400 for a CPU, and Nvidia are getting away with a 30-50% price hike on their past gen. Because no one is standing up and saying "Hey, this is a total rip off and I would avoid this gen if that's their game".

No. Instead of that I've read countless Broadwell E reviews where they didn't rip into Intel at all, so on the face of it they were actually quite positive reviews. Even when you can get a higher core/thread Xeon for the same money as a 10 core Broadwell E.

So not only are we still being sold server handmedowns they are now actually more expensive than the server CPUs themselves ! and we're not being told that's a bad thing ! Actually, people have been quite positive about Broadwell E.

FFS.
rollo 22nd June 2016, 13:20 Quote
It's nothing to do with reviews, bit tech will probably not post there views for this article but I'd imagine it's sub 5000.

People buy what they can afford of each generation without ever viewing a review. I did not read a single 680 review till after I brought the card. I've still not read a single Intel CPU review fully in about 5-6 years.

Motherboard reviews are even more pointless.

People really do not care, do you think one low score review would hurt Nvidia? It would hurt the website that give it more as they could end up black listed against future products. It's why NDA breaching is no longer done, it's why there's no linked performance metrics of the 480 in multiple games.

Intel and Nvidia dominate a market that is not controlled by monopolys. Computer products will never become a needed item like water or electricity.

ZEN will be the PC markets change for better or worse, if ZEN is not a success then the domination of the big 2 will see prices in crazy land.

It's not already there. Word of Mouth sells products better than any review will.
Shirty 22nd June 2016, 13:21 Quote
Isn't this how markets work? All AMD need to do is release a competing product at a lower price point and Nvidia will be forced to move on thier pricing. But right now there is no single card that can offer the same performance as a 1080 and only a few to trouble the 1070, so they have priced it into last generation's hierarchy.

Makes complete sense to me. Personally I won't touch this new generation until pricing dips well below £300. It's a ridiculous state of affairs, but entirely unavoidable in today's profit-driven consumer marketplace.
rollo 22nd June 2016, 13:43 Quote
People do not get that bit shirty. Competition leads to lower prices. No competition and we get priced higher.
Yadda 22nd June 2016, 13:44 Quote
It's all very neat. I wonder why AMD haven't released any parts in the higher price bracket, and why Nvidia haven't released any in the lower price bracket?

That would be competition. As things are, they might as well be two brands owned by the same company.
Redbeaver 22nd June 2016, 14:40 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harlequin
if the gtx 970 sold so well , why do the major etailers still carry a lot of stock when they knew the replacements were coming?

because it sold so well and will STILL sells well for the next few months. Guess what's going to be a hotseller next Black Friday deals?
Vault-Tec 22nd June 2016, 14:47 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by rollo
It's nothing to do with reviews, bit tech will probably not post there views for this article but I'd imagine it's sub 5000.


Tosh. If a reviewer tells you a product is fantastic and recommends it that's usually a nod to go ahead and buy it.

Some one wrote in CPC once (might have even been Bindi) that PC stuff is being made and sold by people who don't want to listen. They make products they think people want and then can't understand why they have failed.

So what bearing does this have? quite a large one, actually. If Nvidia release cards up to 100% more expensive than their last gen cards in the same tier and all of the reviewers are excitedly telling us how wonderful they are then people will buy them. If however they had a chance to voice their concerns and explained to Nvidia that the cost of entry is too high etc and people did not buy because of this they would be forced to listen.

However, it's a no win situation. If you tell a company you think their product sucks they throw a sulk and strike you off and you no longer get their gear to review.

Look at that Corsair thing recently, where one of their employees/reps came and asked exactly what people wanted. Look at the response from people who don't review hardware.

"Your fans are cheap and nasty"

"Your cases can be flimsy and made to look better than they are"

And so on. Now go and find me a review of their fans/cases that ever points any of that out ! you won't find it !

So these people not only do what they want to do and make products they want to make but they then throw a strop *if* some one has the balls to speak out.

Unfortunately that number of people these days is zero. Tom Logan learned the hard way what happens if you paint a product badly. Over a year off from Kingston and nearly 18 months before NZXT gave him anything else.

As for me understanding the situation? I understand it perfectly well, thanks. We are being f****d royally and you're blaming it on AMD ! it seems to me that you don't quite grasp the concept of being conned.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yadda
It's all very neat. I wonder why AMD haven't released any parts in the higher price bracket, and why Nvidia haven't released any in the lower price bracket?

That would be competition. As things are, they might as well be two brands owned by the same company.

Yup. If Nvidia are miles ahead and fully in control then it's like watching a boxing match with one of the boxers missing both his arms.

This isn't competition it's complete dominance.

Watch in a week or two when Nvidia release the 1060 for £220 or so every one will say "Wow thanks Nvidia good old Nvidia !" without realising of course that the only reason the price was as it was was down to AMD. Had it not been for the RX 480 they would have been hung out to dry for £300+

I think Rollo gets confused sometimes, because in his mind it's actually AMD's fault.

Honestly the whole situation just sucks. I remember a time years ago where I had so many choices on GPUs. Now it's a good one or a crap one. There's nothing in between the two.
Yadda 22nd June 2016, 15:40 Quote
I wonder if AMD and Nvidia will ever release similar cards again, at the same price-point and at the same time?

It would be nice for a change.
rollo 22nd June 2016, 16:24 Quote
Can't see that happening Yadda.
Yadda 22nd June 2016, 16:57 Quote
Sadly Rollo, I think you're right.
xxxsonic1971 22nd June 2016, 17:51 Quote
[QUOTE=Vault-Tec]
Sheesh seriously this is just nuts. My head hurts just thinking about it !

I love you man!! I love reading your posts and comments. Keep it going!!x
Anfield 22nd June 2016, 23:30 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yadda
I wonder if AMD and Nvidia will ever release similar cards again, at the same price-point and at the same time?

It would be nice for a change.

Since AMD moved away from TSMC the difference between cards from AMD and Nvidia will only increase in the future (which one will come out on top remains to be seen with each product cycle, but similar schedule and such? A thing of the past unless massive coincidence).
SchizoFrog 24th June 2016, 23:56 Quote
Not been around for the past week and just catching up here now... and... well... it's a cesspool of diatribe in here.

We shouldn't 'blame' AMD for their part in the current situation (after all, it is their previous business decisions that has led them to be in the financial and development situation that they are) but rather 'go to the source' and blame nVidia for price gouging. Yet at the same time, we shouldn't 'go to the source' and blame those willing to buy these products but instead we should blame the reviewers for biased and manipulative articles that somehow coerce buyers in to parting with their cash?

If the opinions of the reviewers here and elsewhere is so corrupt, why even come to the website?
(That is rhetorical, please do NOT bother to answer that...)

Seems like I can even enjoy a good hardware review any more... I can't imagine how the guys behind the site feel. Water flows from duck's back... be like duck. :)
ModSquid 7th July 2016, 12:53 Quote
Same here - been offline for a bit.

I say - review the tech, compare it to its peers/ancestors, give us the price. I'm assuming we're all adults. Vote with your wallets.
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