Alike is not bashing at all. I am pretty shocked at ATI's behaviour and I am a proud new owner or Powercolor 4770's in Crossfire which arrived today. The cards are excellent and do seem to have good OC potential as outlined by Bit Tech.
I would have preferred the reference cooler as it looks awesome and I prefer heat out of my case, but tbh these cards don't run hot AT ALL and unlike some on other tech sites moaning about noise, the "third party"cooler isn't loud at all. ATI are onto a winner here and this is coming from a die hard Nvidia enthusiast with dual GTX285's in my other rig.
I'm going to make a affordable built following your guidelines for this month. Should I get the 4770 or stick with the 4830 like the previous month?
Can you sell me your reference card cheap:P I'm sure you get lots of goodies at bit tech where they just give it to you and its up to you what to do with it :P
Folding@home=novelty, how many people buy based on that. Power section, it obviously does not require all the extra bits. Bang for the buck, quid, euro... it's a tough market in that price range. Overall it's a good buy particularly in crossfire. It's great to see pressure from EITHER company because we get more choice and better prices. Good on ATI for bringing out a new, evolutionary chip that hints at what might be around the corner.
I have to say the thing about the actual reference cards (I don't really buy this thing about "premium" and "value" reference designs) that bugs me the most is the change of the fan power connector from 3 pins to 2 pins. Absolutely *no* money has been saved there, yet it effectively removes the ability to switch the default cooler for an after-market one (fanless designs excluded).
For what it's worth I've absolutely no problem with the HD 4770 as such. It's a great design, especially for the money. I just believe AMD/ATi shot itself in the foot by pulling this reference card "switcheroo".
ATI doesn't ship these AIB partners fully assembled cards or anything even remotely close. ATI hasn't made fully assembled cards in I don't know how long. They ship out PCBs and GPUs and leave it up to the partner to decide what to do from there. It isn't like ATI ships the partner a fully-assembled board, which the partner then boxes up and sells.
ATi hasn't manufactured cards in years, if ever. As far as I recall their main manufacturer is Sapphire or rather its parent, PC Partner. And yes, they ship out complete cards. Just attach your own personal sticker.
nVidia does much the same, although very possibly not with PC Partner as the manufacturer. Incidentally, PC Partner "does" nVidia too. They use the Zotac brand/subsidiary for that.
Sapphire isn't ATI, which is my whole point, and every 4770 on the market is not manufactured by Sapphire.
As for ATI making the cards themselves, I think they stopped doing it sometime around the R300 days. (I still have my "Built by ATI" 9700 Pro lying around here somewhere)
All "Built by ATi" cards were built by Sapphire. Also, it's a fairly sure bet that all HD 4770 cards are manufactured by Sapphire (or, as I said, its parent company PC Partner). And you're not really proving your point at all. :)
Originally Posted by azrael- For what it's worth I've absolutely no problem with the HD 4770 as such. It's a great design, especially for the money. I just believe AMD/ATi shot itself in the foot by pulling this reference card "switcheroo".
How many times do I have to give you AMD's official stance? AMD designs a reference card (doesn't matter who manufactures it) and then the partners then use that reference card as a basis for their own designs - at least that is what AMD says officially. Whether or not that is the case is of course up for debate, but it's the same on Nvidia's side too so it's certainly very plausible.
FWIW, not every ATI card is manufactured by PC Partner, but the lion's share are - that's because Sapphire is the lion's share of the market.
Originally Posted by Tim S How many times do I have to give you AMD's official stance? AMD designs a reference card (doesn't matter who manufactures it) and then the partners then use that reference card as a basis for their own designs - at least that is what AMD says officially. Whether or not that is the case is of course up for debate, but it's the same on Nvidia's side too so it's certainly very plausible.
FWIW, not every ATI card is manufactured by PC Partner, but the lion's share are - that's because Sapphire is the lion's share of the market.
I'm fully aware of what you've previously written, but just because ATi (or nVidia) says so doesn't make it true. Reality seems to prove my point, though. Or are you arguing that (pretty much) every partner comes up with an identical design, that doesn't resemble what you (and pretty much everyone else on or off the net) has reviewed as the reference design?
And I'm certainly aware that PC Partner doesn't manufacture *every* ATi-based card. Actually, I've never claimed that. As far as I recall not very long ago ASUS' manufacturing arm (what is now known as Pegatron, I believe) was used as the manufacturer of the reference design for several models.
I'm not sure where all the ire is coming from? I've never claimed that the HD 4770 is a bad card, just that it was a bad decision on ATi's part to send a version of the card to reviewers that cannot be readily bought, if at all.
I agree. The phrase "blame bit-tech" in an earlier post of mine was ill chosen and a bit harsh. I apologize.
The thing is, I hold bit-tech's reviews in high regard. If I didn't, I could care less about what you guys write, but I do. When I saw the second HD 4770 review and it didn't mention these apparent issues I was a bit disappointed.
I would have expected you to raise these issues with AMD/ATi *and* write about them. Set the record straight, so to speak, because that's what you usually do. It's a shame you didn't in this case.
The Gigabyte one is the "proper" card, that you can buy. You can also buy the very same card from other ATI partners. Miraculously, they've all decided to go for the same cheap design, but in reality you wouldn't notice a difference, because the performance is the same. Even with the so called cheaper version of the PCB, the card is still very good.
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ReplyI would have preferred the reference cooler as it looks awesome and I prefer heat out of my case, but tbh these cards don't run hot AT ALL and unlike some on other tech sites moaning about noise, the "third party"cooler isn't loud at all. ATI are onto a winner here and this is coming from a die hard Nvidia enthusiast with dual GTX285's in my other rig.
Great job AMD/ ATI you have another convert!
I thought this was a CARD REVIEW TOPIC and not a discussing on the merits of folding.. but maybe im going blind.
Anyway, nice review, but im hoping for a 1Gb version, which will help with some applications and add little cost.
PS. Out of interest as anyone seen a "reference" model for same, as in with the better cooler, i cant find a single manufacturer that has one.
Can you sell me your reference card cheap:P I'm sure you get lots of goodies at bit tech where they just give it to you and its up to you what to do with it :P
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-geforce-gtx,2270-6.html
I do suggest you get a GTS 250 though, it's about $20 more for a decent upgrade in performance.
For what it's worth I've absolutely no problem with the HD 4770 as such. It's a great design, especially for the money. I just believe AMD/ATi shot itself in the foot by pulling this reference card "switcheroo".
ATI doesn't ship these AIB partners fully assembled cards or anything even remotely close. ATI hasn't made fully assembled cards in I don't know how long. They ship out PCBs and GPUs and leave it up to the partner to decide what to do from there. It isn't like ATI ships the partner a fully-assembled board, which the partner then boxes up and sells.
nVidia does much the same, although very possibly not with PC Partner as the manufacturer. Incidentally, PC Partner "does" nVidia too. They use the Zotac brand/subsidiary for that.
As for ATI making the cards themselves, I think they stopped doing it sometime around the R300 days. (I still have my "Built by ATI" 9700 Pro lying around here somewhere)
How many times do I have to give you AMD's official stance? AMD designs a reference card (doesn't matter who manufactures it) and then the partners then use that reference card as a basis for their own designs - at least that is what AMD says officially. Whether or not that is the case is of course up for debate, but it's the same on Nvidia's side too so it's certainly very plausible.
FWIW, not every ATI card is manufactured by PC Partner, but the lion's share are - that's because Sapphire is the lion's share of the market.
And I'm certainly aware that PC Partner doesn't manufacture *every* ATi-based card. Actually, I've never claimed that. As far as I recall not very long ago ASUS' manufacturing arm (what is now known as Pegatron, I believe) was used as the manufacturer of the reference design for several models.
I'm not sure where all the ire is coming from? I've never claimed that the HD 4770 is a bad card, just that it was a bad decision on ATi's part to send a version of the card to reviewers that cannot be readily bought, if at all.
The thing is, I hold bit-tech's reviews in high regard. If I didn't, I could care less about what you guys write, but I do. When I saw the second HD 4770 review and it didn't mention these apparent issues I was a bit disappointed.
I would have expected you to raise these issues with AMD/ATi *and* write about them. Set the record straight, so to speak, because that's what you usually do. It's a shame you didn't in this case.
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