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Nvidia GeForce 3DVision & How 3D Works

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TomD22 9th January 2009, 18:01 Quote
Is a 120hz monitor 100% essential, though?

Forgive me if this is silly, but it sounds a bit like those FPS players who swear blind that 60fps minimum is essential, when actually you can't (or, at least, I can't) notice any difference between 30 and 60...

What I mean is, does a 60hz display, effectively at 30hz with the glasses on, really look too flickery to use? Or would it be sort-of OK? Or maybe even just look fine?

Would be great to know....
Cupboard 9th January 2009, 18:28 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomD22
Is a 120hz monitor 100% essential, though?
<snip>

I doubt that it would be OK. Most TV broadcasts are ~30Hz but TVs are still usually 60Hz so there must be a reason for that.

I though that there were a reasonably number of 120Hz plasma TVs which would presumably work quite well with this. It is funny that the easiest way to get 120Hz is essentially to go back a few years to CRT (or mini CRT in the case of plasmas).

With the HUD - it is not surprising that you are having problems considering a HUD is usually 2D and just in front of your eyes. I think you need to put a little screen in the glasses of maybe even wear a helmet! On a more serious note, it might work if you were to use two projectors, one at 120Hz to do the main image and then a second 60Hz one for the HUD, so that wasn't seen in 3D
dmak 9th January 2009, 18:38 Quote
I am very curious to try a set of these some time, I would especially like to try them in conjunction with that ocz brain mouse... thing.
dire_wolf 9th January 2009, 19:01 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulatin
It doesn't seem as impressive as this - http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=Jd3-eiid-Uw

Now THAT is impressive, so simple too
WildThing 9th January 2009, 20:20 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gareth Halfacree
New technology? These things were available for the Amiga! See here for an overview of previous generations of shutter glasses.

Ok, so the whole idea of viewing things in 3D isn't new, and in this article the history of 3D vision is even briefly explained, I realise that. What I was talking about was this particular product. I will wait and see how nVidia, and possibly ATi in the future, develop this new line of 3D vision before I go out and buy one. That's all I meant.
r0z|3o0n 9th January 2009, 20:48 Quote
Not a single RTS in there? Admittedly the effect might have been minimal but it would be interesting to see if it worked at all or if it just turned everything into a vomit-inducing mess.
Gareth Halfacree 9th January 2009, 21:05 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by WildThing
Ok, so the whole idea of viewing things in 3D isn't new, and in this article the history of 3D vision is even briefly explained, I realise that. What I was talking about was this particular product. I will wait and see how nVidia, and possibly ATi in the future, develop this new line of 3D vision before I go out and buy one. That's all I meant.
Fair enough, buy if you'd followed the link I provided you'd see that previous generations of shutter glasses - including one for the Atari ST which I never knew existed - are for all intents and purposes identical products.
azrael- 9th January 2009, 22:29 Quote
There's a good on the subject over at The Inquirer: http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/192/1050192/nvidia-picks-the-wrong-3d-glasses-technology

I wholeheartedly agree with Charlie although his writing can be a bit "inflammatory"... :)
freedom810 9th January 2009, 23:23 Quote
I remember watching a small movie with the whole 3D glasses thing. It hurt my eyes after awhile, I could only play a game for 10minutes or something before my eyes messed up.
LanMare 9th January 2009, 23:46 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulatin
It doesn't seem as impressive as this - http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=Jd3-eiid-Uw

Really Nice... Simple idea but with very potential
Nature 10th January 2009, 02:18 Quote
I can't find a 2560x1600 monitor with a 120hz refresh rate. Do you all know of any?
tsukasa 10th January 2009, 11:30 Quote
You guys should try Trials 2 on Steam (change the camera mode to first person), and Mirrors Edge in 3D. I know from my anaglyph glasses that Trials 2 in first person is the most amazing 3d experience ever, and I would imaging Mirrors Edge will be just as compelling (especially since it has no hud).

Seriously, try Trials 2 out, its a 30mb game. You won't regret it.
philgross 10th January 2009, 16:44 Quote
Three things I would have liked to have seen in this review:

1) a little more technical discussion on the HUD issue, which seems to be the biggest problem. In particular, is it possible for developers to assign a higher Z-depth to HUD elements, while still allowing them to be always visible / "on top" of scenery? I know real-world HUDs e.g. in aircraft are designed to be at "infinity" focus.

Or would it be best to have HUD elements appear to be at the average depth of items on screen? Or the depth of the item in the center of the screen? Bascially, does nVidia have suggestions for developers about how to make good 3D-compatible HUDs, and how hard will those solutions be to implement?

2) try it with Dead Space. Dead Space has a fairly radical HUD that is entirely in the game world (health meter is on your back, HUD appears over your gun). It seems like it might work much better with a 3D system.

3) try it combined with a Novint Falcon haptic controller. Does the combination give even a higher level of immersion, or is the whole not greater than the sum of its parts?
Delphium 10th January 2009, 18:30 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Baz
Just to clear some points up here

The tech works on any 120Hz monitor - CRT or TFT
We tested using both Vista 64 and 32 bit throughout.

Which driver version was used for x64?
yuriythebest 10th January 2009, 19:50 Quote
I read the review and it was very in-depth, however I was very surprised that you mentioned the zalman 3d monitor while, very conspicuously, omitting the iz3d monitor which costs 399$ and is the leading competitor in this area. I happen to have one, and among other games, played Team Fortress 2 on it and because of the iz3d drivers I had no issues with the user interface that you reported.
Ontheronix 11th January 2009, 15:00 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Delphium
I notice in the artice that the kit came supplied with a long DVI to HDMI cable, thus would it be safe to assume then that these glasses are compatible with digital displays?

Ive already got a set of the eDimensional 3D glasses which ive had for a few years now, which work in exactly the same way as these nvidia set, however the glasses refresh rate is linked to that of the VGA signal, so have to install a dongle between the gfx card a monitor.
So again I assume the refresh signal is supplied via USB for the nvidia set.

One of the main issues with the eDimensional set is that it lacked drivers, specially for vista.

Ive a 42" plasma screen which supports 120hz refresh, and can confirm that they do indeed work very well,
Probably it won't take long before the nVidia drivers have been hacked or ATI releases drivers for their cards ?! Altough, I hope so. B)
wolfticket 11th January 2009, 15:25 Quote
3D gaming. Now in 3D!

;)
Bindibadgi 11th January 2009, 15:46 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuriythebest
I read the review and it was very in-depth, however I was very surprised that you mentioned the zalman 3d monitor while, very conspicuously, omitting the iz3d monitor which costs 399$ and is the leading competitor in this area. I happen to have one, and among other games, played Team Fortress 2 on it and because of the iz3d drivers I had no issues with the user interface that you reported.

Personally I've never heard of it until you just mentioned it. :?
Mister_Tad 11th January 2009, 16:50 Quote
This, oddly enough, brings back memories circa 2001 when I used to play games in 3D on this puppy. Even then the tech was a few years old

The drivers were a bit dodgy with some games, but on others the effect was pretty breathtaking. Pity it induced migraines after an hour or so of play. Perhaps that was more down to the effective 60hz refresh and evil flicker from it on a CRT and would be better on an LCD.
HourBeforeDawn 12th January 2009, 09:45 Quote
why is the rest of the industry going one way and nVidia decided to go the other way and by other way towards a tech that has proved to be dated and well for the most part a failure.
Xir 12th January 2009, 12:07 Quote
hmmm, this was a feature of the original GeForce256 back in 1999.
I had an ELSA Revelator setup to toy with.
Caused similar problems though because in 1999 finding a CRT that did >170hz (Headaches below 85hz with CRT's) was a problem.

Played Half Life 1 with this...took us about 45min's to start getting motionsickness. ;-)
Maximus_is 13th January 2009, 07:45 Quote
I found it interesting on the Comfort & Style Page:
"Things like that almost balance out the fact that you’ll probably need to get a new 1200hz monitor in order to actually use the tech. It’s that unfortunate requirement for a specific type of monitor, which is a sad limitation of the technology, which really cripples the 3D vision…but we’ll get to that later."

Now a 1200Hz monitor is the definition of style!!
sui_winbolo 14th January 2009, 23:29 Quote
Question, do those fit over a normal pair of eye glasses?
KindDragon 16th January 2009, 22:32 Quote
Did you try iZ3D Monitor (www.iz3d.com)?
Compare NVidia and iZ3D stereo driver performance, for example in anaglyph mode?
CardJoe 17th January 2009, 09:24 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by sui_winbolo
Question, do those fit over a normal pair of eye glasses?

They do.
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