Nvidia GeForce GTX 295 1,792MB & Quad SLI

hehe oh I see.. yeah I thought you were out of control for a second- my significant other is a teacher and the kids today- it's hard not to have a bleak view anymore =]

You gotta love the design of that cooler! :O
Me love GTX 295 so big!

To answer another person's post:

The nVidia card is dual PCB out of necessity. It is not feasible to put two of their giant, monolithic GPUs on one board. The square-footage needed to carry the GPUs, memory and necessary power/IO hardware would result in a PCB that is 2 feet long and suffers from intense EMI and third-harmonic distortion issues due to the exceedingly long trace lengths to run from one end to the other.

At that point, the heat concerns would be merely an afterthought.

No, folks, nVidia is doing things the same way they have since GF6. Bigger, more expensive, more power-hungry. It's a brute-force design theory. One reason the chip is so goddamn big is due to the use of the 512 (or 448) bit memory bus. They use it instead of transitioning to newer memory tech that allows for more narrow buses. Another is the usage of 65nm processes, they use it because it's proven and they don't have to re-tool. Only now, more recently, have they begun to re-tool the GT200 for 55nm, but it's too late, IMO.

I think that is all going to change after the blow RV770 dealt them. ATi really rained on their parade just as the band was getting kicked up to a good pace.

The next generation, or maybe the one after that, will be something to look for.

Just my $0.02

And yes I know this particular card is die-shrunk to 55nm now, but it's still far to large for a single-GPU solution.

I was pointing out the fact the original silicon didn't use 55nm as part of an attempt to illustrate how stuck-in-a-rut nvidia had become in terms of GPU development.

well, it's ATI that made a bold move and got it right, doesn't mean that nVidia suddenly sucks. GT200 is probably going to be the largest ever. GT212 is rumoured to be around 300mm2, on the 40nm process, supposed to come in may or april. This card is just an excersize in taking the crown back from ATI, when they never thought they'd have to. It's doing that and only that, and the card is not worth it. I dont think the 2-PCB approach is a very elegant way of solving it. They are streching, reaching, and as soon as GT212 is out, they'll drop driver support for this thing like a brick (similar to the 9800GX2). Stick with the ATI if you need so much power, if you need more go GTX 280 SLI.

In the real world we have this thing called Folding. And its actually fairly popular.

And, you know, we use the green cards to do it with these days...

Any chance?

Originally Posted by Sh0velman
To answer another person's post:

The nVidia card is dual PCB out of necessity. It is not feasible to put two of their giant, monolithic GPUs on one board. The square-footage needed to carry the GPUs, memory and necessary power/IO hardware would result in a PCB that is 2 feet long and suffers from intense EMI and third-harmonic distortion issues due to the exceedingly long trace lengths to run from one end to the other.

At that point, the heat concerns would be merely an afterthought.

No, folks, nVidia is doing things the same way they have since GF6. Bigger, more expensive, more power-hungry. It's a brute-force design theory. One reason the chip is so goddamn big is due to the use of the 512 (or 448) bit memory bus. They use it instead of transitioning to newer memory tech that allows for more narrow buses. Another is the usage of 65nm processes, they use it because it's proven and they don't have to re-tool. Only now, more recently, have they begun to re-tool the GT200 for 55nm, but it's too late, IMO.

I think that is all going to change after the blow RV770 dealt them. ATi really rained on their parade just as the band was getting kicked up to a good pace.

The next generation, or maybe the one after that, will be something to look for.

Just my $0.02

i liked ur 2 cents, now tell me smthing since u seem to have a fair view , not like many fanatics
would u got for 295 or the 4870x2? please if it aint too much trouble, justify ur choice but dont take money into acount hehe
im sticking to the hd 4870x2 atm since im still waiting on the sideport, but still my rig is gonna be a nice i7 and i intend to squeeze the quality off the games i usually use, so its gonna be 1080p or up, and the hd4870x2 has shown that it can and does stand by itself
(btw, the price dropping rocks hehe)

Originally Posted by Undercloacker

i liked ur 2 cents, now tell me smthing since u seem to have a fair view , not like many fanatics
would u got for 295 or the 4870x2? please if it aint too much trouble, justify ur choice but dont take money into acount hehe
im sticking to the hd 4870x2 atm since im still waiting on the sideport, but still my rig is gonna be a nice i7 and i intend to squeeze the quality off the games i usually use, so its gonna be 1080p or up, and the hd4870x2 has shown that it can and does stand by itself
(btw, the price dropping rocks hehe)

If price is no issue, get the GTX295, of course, unless you're playing at 2560 resolution

If price really is an issue, get the X2.

I'm a fan of whatever is fastest, and right now, that's the GTX295. Just be aware of what another poster said, they'll drop driver support and that'll be that, in 6-12 months, whereas the ATI drivers will only get BETTER over the next 6-12 months.

Another benefit of the X2 is it can be Crossfire'd with another 1GB 4870 for a cheap 3 GPU solution.

Choice is yours, but I don't think it comes down to pick your camp, just pick what you can afford.

I replaced a GeForce 8600GTS (after my 7900GT died at 1 year old) with a 4870 512MB 3 weeks ago, I had 200 bucks to spend, the 4870 is the clear winner at that price.

Get what you can afford, it's a great time to be video card shopping right now!

"BFG Tech also has a 100-day trade up program"

Not exactly true.

Today I contacted BFG Support on the phone during normal business hours wanting to trade up my 2 BFG 280GTX's before my 100 days ends. NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. I was told by BFG Cusomer Service that just because the 295 has been launched doesn't mean it is available for trade-up. I was told trade-up is a luxury and they don't know when stock will be allocated for that. Though the 295 may be available everywhere else it is not listed at the BFG store and that is where trade-ups must go through. If your 100 day trade-up period ends while they are not allocating stock and making the card available for you, it will not happen. I wish this were not the case but I just got it from the horses mouth.

100 day trade-up program? Not a very good incentive to trust BFG if you ask me. Since my 100 days is nearing an end, my only choices given me for trade-ups under my online registered profile are 2 oc versions of the non-oc 280gtx I already have.

If anyone has anything to say about this practice tell me what you think and share it with others! It would be nice if they let you initiate the trade-up and then you would waite utill BFG decides to allocate stock for you or when ever general stock is available but from what I understand you have to initiate trade-up online with what choices are offered there before your 100 day trade-up period ends. When your 100 days are up - thats it. It is over and ended.

I would really love to use my trade-ups on the 285s available next week as my 100 days goes just beyond that introduction date but from what I learned about doing it right now with the just launched 295 it seems unlikely. I got absolutely no assurances, promises, or implied "wiggle room" during my BFG customer service phone call.

Anyone else in the boat with me?

omg, why use really old nvidia drivers, i mean iv been running the 185.20 for a week now >_> not a far test ino

Originally Posted by Sh0velman
To answer another person's post:

The nVidia card is dual PCB out of necessity. It is not feasible to put two of their giant, monolithic GPUs on one board. The square-footage needed to carry the GPUs, memory and necessary power/IO hardware would result in a PCB that is 2 feet long and suffers from intense EMI and third-harmonic distortion issues due to the exceedingly long trace lengths to run from one end to the other.

At that point, the heat concerns would be merely an afterthought.

No, folks, nVidia is doing things the same way they have since GF6. Bigger, more expensive, more power-hungry. It's a brute-force design theory. One reason the chip is so goddamn big is due to the use of the 512 (or 448) bit memory bus. They use it instead of transitioning to newer memory tech that allows for more narrow buses. Another is the usage of 65nm processes, they use it because it's proven and they don't have to re-tool. Only now, more recently, have they begun to re-tool the GT200 for 55nm, but it's too late, IMO.

I think that is all going to change after the blow RV770 dealt them. ATi really rained on their parade just as the band was getting kicked up to a good pace.

The next generation, or maybe the one after that, will be something to look for.

Just my $0.02

Do you know HD4870 X2, HD 3870X2? These cards use only one PCB and they are well cooled.

In fact, my criticism goes to Nvidia that saved money on building a project less modern than ATI's just to respond faster. It seems like two GTX 260 glued into one card, even with the SLI connector!!! The same happened with the 9800 GX2 and HD3870 X2, remmember?
It might be obligatory: as quicker they respond to ATI as quicker they will earn more profits. No matter how they do!

In terms of memory, Nvidia’s GTX295 uses a couple 448 bit memory bus and still can’t reach the band of a couple 256bit GDDR5 memory bus of HD4870X2.

wow, that just sucks. I'd contact a manager about that, it's absolutely rediculous. 100 days is 3 months. If you buy top-end cards, it's not likely that a better one will be released within that time, and if you as a customer are not allowed to wait for stock to be allocated, the whole program becomes worthless for the top-end cards.

The program would still be viable for the cards below the top ones, but that is generally not the target audience for trade-up programs, is it? Rubbish!

Yeah I noticed on another forum that EVGA has a wating list for the 295 step up program. Their customers are placed in a que. EVGA rocks! At least they guarantee their step ups. I think they are up to 70 or 80 in line already and they just started wit the 295s today.

HA HA Thanks for encouraging me. I just called them back and they made an exception for me since I have contacted them several times recently about this subject. If the 285 doesn't appear as a trade-up option in my online registered profile before the 100 days is up I can still trade-up since they are very aware of my persistance and the fact that technically my 100 days ends 1 day after the 285 is due to launch. BFG now ROCKS!!!! Good Times...

Originally Posted by Doc101
HA HA Thanks for encouraging me. I just called them back and they made an exception for me since I have contacted them several times recently about this subject. If the 285 doesn't appear as a trade-up option in my online registered profile before the 100 days is up I can still trade-up since they are very aware of my persistance and the fact that technically my 100 days ends 1 day after the 285 is due to launch. BFG now ROCKS!!!! Good Times...

LMAO, sometimes things are far more rewarding if you;ve had to shout at people to get it :D

:o) I was very diplomatic at all times but you know what they say: The squeaky wheel gets the oil! I really wanted the 285s just because they will run cooler and 2 in SLI probably will be better for me. I game in a uber geek high 5040x1050 resolution through 3 wide screen LCDs using a Triple-Head-2-Go. My computer just recognizes it as a really big 65" widescreen LCD. Who knows, when the prices on the 285s drop with the 212 introduction in a few months I might have justification to try TRI-SLI!!!!!!! :)

Greetings!

Originally Posted by Article
It's GT200's B1 stepping...

Not B2 or B3?

Power consumption on these new cards is getting crazy. Arguably we don't need this much power, better coding, with good engine scaling and more clever architecture would be a much more welcome change for me.

And I still say they look like VHS tapes.

I still find the design (dual pcb) to be inferior to the 4870x2 design and the price tag of course, so I would call this more of a tie then retaking the titles.

Originally Posted by MJudg

In terms of memory, Nvidia’s GTX295 uses a couple 448 bit memory bus and still can’t reach the band of a couple 256bit GDDR5 memory bus of HD4870X2.

You're wrong.

Your fanboism was pretty obvious in your first and second sentences.

Look at the benchmark results for every game, especially crysis.

Look at 2560 resolution. Notice how the 4870X2 rigs are faster? thats because the 448bit buses are NOT fast enough and do NOT keep up with the 256bit GDDR5 combo.

Nice job ignoring test results tho.

disregard that reply, totally misread.

Sorry!

Mmmmmmm...interesting observation:
"Far Cry 2 is a mixed bag for the GeForce GTX 295, demonstrating performance which is, for the most part, identical to an SLI GTX 260-216 configuration. While performance without anti aliasing at 1,680 x 1,050 is somewhat disappointing and clearly slower than a Radeon HD 4870 X2, turning on anti aliasing sees the GTX 295 overtake the 4870 X2 until we reach 2,560 x 1,600, when the 4870 X2 has the advantage at 0xAA, the GTX 295 the advantage at 4xAA and both perform very similarly at 2xAA.

While this might look like a hit for the GTX 295 though, it's nothing of the sort - who would want to play modern games on such expensive hardware and leave anti-aliasing turned off?"

Bit arse-about-face isn't it? Or is this a job application for The Inquirer ?

I have just seen the prices of these on OCUK and was going to make a comment on how they are overpriced etc right up until I checked the prices of the HD4870X2. The card I paid £360 for a month ago (when cable (USD/GBP spot was in the same ballpark as it is now ~ 1.50 (so that can't be used as an excuse)) is now £410. That is pure markup!

So at this price range (£430ish for the GTX 295 and £410ish for the HD4870X2) it does make the decision harder.

I spent quite a bit on an 8800GTS in March last year. Now I'm gutted. I knew things were going to change and get faster, but this is ridiculous!

Oh well, as long as I can play at 1680 then I'll be happy.

Andy

it's $450 now.... schweet........