i can't really see nvidia having an answer to this for a while. even a die shrink on GT200 wont bring them into the territory they need to be in - it looks like the AMD architecture is just substantially more efficient. Particularly in terms of profit AMD must have won this round easily. I'm no fan boy - i bought a GTX260 just the other week because it was cheaper than the 4870 for pretty much the same performance but that has to be hurting nvidia - to be selling chips that are SO much bigger than AMDs for less money has to be putting the profits in AMDs coffers. i just hope that money gets sunk back into R&D for video cards - not siphoned off to address the company's other troubles.
Originally Posted by zoot2boot to be selling chips that are SO much bigger than AMDs for less money has to be putting the profits in AMDs coffers.
Its been such a long time that it has happened i don't think amd knows what to do with it, as a matter of fact has amd owned the performance crown yet in the GPU, market or is this the first time since it took over ati that it has.
i just came back from a business trip and was itching to read this review, i'd read some one other sites as they seem to churn them out quicker but i draw no solid conclusions from theirs as i dont trust them, and now i come back from denmark to see this and can finally put any doubts from other reviews to bed, its fecking awesome and i love it. Nice one timmy, nice on son, i'd feckin love to get a hold of one of these, soo jealous of you guys at bit-tech....i dont care what nvidia fanboys say, nvidia will roll out something to beat it, i hope they do, it pushes amd/ati harder and drives our costs down, and then amd can strap a turbocharged rocket on the 4870x2's ass and the same happens again, i'm just glad to see ati at the top spanking some ass again, now maybe if those engineeers spent some time over on the cpu side, amd/ati might compete on 2 fronts!
Love seeing ati on top, roll on nvidia's response, i want to see where these 2 giants push the boundaries....AMD FTW HOOOOOORAH!
Tim. Take your time if you need it. There is no need to rush your articles. I know how thorough your articles are. And expect them to be of high standard. You should not have to work 24/7 to get there. :D
Sidenote: A post on the forums with a chart for GPU(card) to monitor size(resolution) would be lovely. It's a bloody mess to figure out what to buy.
Originally Posted by Tim S Won't happen... max board power would be ludicrous even if they could get the heat under control.
yup, not until the die shrink atleast and even then it would probably be more of a 260x2.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rollo
power consumption of a 4870 x2 will mean its never 3 way crossfired . As that would be more psu than is in existance. Even duel id say is past the idea.
483 watt in use is just WOW
not true, 483 is the complete system, not the graphicscard. however, you can have a max of 2, there is only one crossfire connector on the cards, so 3 of them woudnt work.
Quote:
Originally Posted by salesman as a matter of fact has amd owned the performance crown yet in the GPU, market or is this the first time since it took over ati that it has.
yup, first time since amd bought ati.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrb_no1 roll on nvidia's response, i want to see where these 2 giants push the boundaries....AMD FTW HOOOOOORAH!
nvidia's response atm is dropping the prices (except in uk of course), no faster card around for immediate release.
DisplayPort is supported by the chip, so it's just a matter of partners implementing it if they see a market for it (that's the biggest problem at the moment).
Originally Posted by ChaosDefinesOrder yeah, that's what I mean, has there been any chatter or hints at any of the partners intending to support it?
Not yet, no... but I guess it is fairly early days. Almost all of the cards made so far will just follow AMD reference design - in the future, there might be additional designs from board partners, much like the Asus EAH3870 X2 (which featured 4 DVI ports).
i given up on my 9800gx2 as to unstable to use (COD4 crashs on the servers called SMART, its an mod AWE4 when an certen next map loads or loads for me to play get an Nice NV4 Nvidia driver BSOD) no SLI works fine, but i had problems with other games stuttering (big micro stuttering) on Smoke that Tanks the FPS down to low 10-20FPS then back up to norm FPS
the 4870x2 looks nice but unable to turn off the CF means not so usefull for folding and i have allways been sole believer in uber fast single cards for an long time and the 9800GX2 is not makeing me want to use SLI (like the 8800GTX owner for 2 years), like SLI you cant know if the CF is working right, and like the 9800GX2 just not stable and consistant (GTX 280 for me as that is an step up from an 8800gtx, the 4870 is more like an small step up from an 9800gtx) i just leave the other 9800GX2 in my second slot for folding 3xGPU on the GTX280 as well (1200w TT toughpower) i can allso put the PyisX onto one of the 9800GX2 cards
all the above may be my fault with SLI not working as well (i can think of 3 things, upgraded mobo but did not reload, CPU mite be broke as it not OC any more or the mobo is half broke, maybe this Striker extreme 1 mobo is crap as not been likeing me ever the Upto date BIOS is no better then the older ones) very sure this does this on vista boot drive as well
i realy would like to buy the 4870x2 as all of my Lower end pcs are all AMD (chipset as well) but its the folding part that leads me away
need to lose this motherboard get an new one as i been mostly limited now on my low speed q6600 now (my amd dual core clocked at 3.3ghz is faster then q6600@2.4) goign to make an new topic for that one
Originally Posted by Tim S Not yet, no... but I guess it is fairly early days. Almost all of the cards made so far will just follow AMD reference design - in the future, there might be additional designs from board partners, much like the Asus EAH3870 X2 (which featured 4 DVI ports).
I just bought one of these and unlimbered it tonight. From the weight and metal projections I felt like I was handling small arms rather than a graphics card :). Now, I need a Danger Den water block for this and I will be UUUUUUUUBER :)
Originally Posted by Otto69 I just bought one of these and unlimbered it tonight. From the weight and metal projections I felt like I was handling small arms rather than a graphics card :). Now, I need a Danger Den water block for this and I will be UUUUUUUUBER :)
Hello across the pond, love the intellect shown.
It's just amazing to me - and this of course is not about just this review, but nearly everyone I've seen. I guess one just doesn't notice it at all offhand.
When the 4870x2 is reviewed, suddenly, SLI setups are absolutely and completely 100% forgotten - as if they don't exist at all - as if they never have.
On the other hand, if the 260 or the 280 is being reviewed, all sort of crossfire configs suddenly appear, and of course for a long time now the 4870x2, and then of course there are questions and endless queries as to why the 260 or 280 is shamed and beaten down...
I mean it is absolutely ASTOUNDING to me.
Now that the 295 (4870x2) killer has hit, I can hardly wait to see the next round of supremely biased tricks, that the mindless masses will drool, drink, and repeat.
I already seen the red 4870x2 fans going into a blanching disbelief mode at the review results.
Let's see, when we test the 9800gx2, we put the 4850 crossfire against it, the 4870 x2 even combos of 4870 CF 512+1024 , but somehow the 4870x2 get the "single card test favor" ONLY.
It's like so much poppycock - i'm just ready to beat the tar out of something. Oh what a great trick, oh that was so masterful, what a wonderful, wonderful review...
Ok, that's all I had to say, and I was not being sarcastic about the intellect I notice across the pond - it's there, and I thoroughly enjoy it. I'm sure the review is great (oh gawd... ok I can't lie very well I'M SURE THE REVIEW IS GREATLY BIASED)
Jiminy crickets.
I think ATI put some new NSA homeland security "designer mind control drug" in the pcb of the ATI cards - yes it's a nasty and invasive experiment but so far it's results have been a huge success !
Good day !
Originally Posted by Tim S Not yet, no... but I guess it is fairly early days. Almost all of the cards made so far will just follow AMD reference design - in the future, there might be additional designs from board partners, much like the Asus EAH3870 X2 (which featured 4 DVI ports).
What they need is some form of pin header where you can put whatever you want on it :)
Originally Posted by SiliconDoc Hello across the pond, love the intellect shown.
It's just amazing to me - and this of course is not about just this review, but nearly everyone I've seen. I guess one just doesn't notice it at all offhand.
When the 4870x2 is reviewed, suddenly, SLI setups are absolutely and completely 100% forgotten - as if they don't exist at all - as if they never have.
On the other hand, if the 260 or the 280 is being reviewed, all sort of crossfire configs suddenly appear, and of course for a long time now the 4870x2, and then of course there are questions and endless queries as to why the 260 or 280 is shamed and beaten down...
I mean it is absolutely ASTOUNDING to me.
Now that the 295 (4870x2) killer has hit, I can hardly wait to see the next round of supremely biased tricks, that the mindless masses will drool, drink, and repeat.
I already seen the red 4870x2 fans going into a blanching disbelief mode at the review results.
Let's see, when we test the 9800gx2, we put the 4850 crossfire against it, the 4870 x2 even combos of 4870 CF 512+1024 , but somehow the 4870x2 get the "single card test favor" ONLY.
It's like so much poppycock - i'm just ready to beat the tar out of something. Oh what a great trick, oh that was so masterful, what a wonderful, wonderful review...
Ok, that's all I had to say, and I was not being sarcastic about the intellect I notice across the pond - it's there, and I thoroughly enjoy it. I'm sure the review is great (oh gawd... ok I can't lie very well I'M SURE THE REVIEW IS GREATLY BIASED)
Jiminy crickets.
I think ATI put some new NSA homeland security "designer mind control drug" in the pcb of the ATI cards - yes it's a nasty and invasive experiment but so far it's results have been a huge success !
Good day !
I get flak from both pools of fanboys - just yesterday I read a thread on another forum suggesting that I'd written a number of "paid for by Nvidia" reviews and now this. Yes, just to satisfy your conspiracy theory, ATI has a department similar to NSA Homeland Security that poisons my mind and makes me write nice things about their products. Heh.
But anyway... let's get back to reality: as the saying goes, if you're getting flak from both sides, you must be pretty close to the truth. So I guess I should say, err, thanks.
Bugger what they say mate, Bit-tech is the one site i actually trust when it comes to reviewing stuff or even talking about it and im sure im not the only one who thinks that around here either
i actually like that you lot say it how it is and **** what others think if only more people were like that tbh
Originally Posted by Tim S I get flak from both pools of fanboys - just yesterday I read a thread on another forum suggesting that I'd written a number of "paid for by Nvidia" reviews and now this. Yes, just to satisfy your conspiracy theory, ATI has a department similar to NSA Homeland Security that poisons my mind and makes me write nice things about their products. Heh.
But anyway... let's get back to reality: as the saying goes, if you're getting flak from both sides, you must be pretty close to the truth. So I guess I should say, err, thanks.
I must say when I first read your reply I wasn't convinced, but I went and checked some of the other reviews on vidcards - and this site does do a lot better than many others.
I agree with you. I saw one site yesterday that was fair - and thanked the guy (the editor in fact) for not towing an agenda. I guess you just lucked out with me seeing your review first when I got here. There are a lot of haters for the top dog that took their money before ATI caught up. A LOT of them.
_____________________________________________________________________
I'm not a normal fanboy, Honesty is my company, so for those bleeding red... (I'd write words against green fanboys but they are quite uncommon or diminutive - in fact, they act like they agree most of the time - so there are plenty of conventional understanding lies out there.)
Cuda, PhysX, NVidia did the 2 cards on one chip first (way back in voodoo2 days) not ATI. The GTX295 is not a greedy swipe for the crown, it is a service to those with single slot 16x boards, and even SLI boards with only 2 slots - and anyone that dislikes CCC but wants massive speed - or bragging rights.
Since the GTX260 is only 1-3 watts higher in 3d and 15-30 watts lower in 2d/idle, the GTX260 has better power characteristics than the 4870 - so no the 4870 doesn't beat it with less power.
The GTX295 however, DOES do that to the 4870x2.
If Nvidia is losing money on their GT200 cores and ATI can drop their prices on the 700/770 then whom is really getting gouged now ? :D Yes, thank you ati for competing and dropping NV's high prices, but if you really can go lower so much easier, why didn't you destroy NV? - we know why....
I'm all for telling the truth.
The 4870 is an awesome card, as well as it's x2 version, but that doesn't mean lying every chance one gets to make it better is the right thing to do - so claiming it wins because 2560 aa af is cool (and often unplayable especially the $1500 moniors) doesn't cut it for honesty, either.
________________________________________________________________________
Just a few things that were already stuck far under my craw when I got here. If you're honest you'll easily admit there's a lot of red fan and a lot of green hate going on. When there's a chance to hurt the top dog that had such high prices for so long, a lot of people will do almost anything to "make it happen".
Originally Posted by Gremlin Bugger what they say mate, Bit-tech is the one site i actually trust when it comes to reviewing stuff or even talking about it and im sure im not the only one who thinks that around here either
i actually like that you lot say it how it is and **** what others think if only more people were like that tbh
Take a look at my posting numbers, and cool off.
I agreee with the fellow - in fact I looked at a few other reviews and this site is not doing what others do as far as the little time I looked.
I jumped perhaps too quickly ( not that he excused my points, he didn't - but I can understand when other reviews here cover what I complained about )
I think this is a great site now - I see the reviews are plenty, I've always liked the /Aussiebrit intellect, and I've sent a link to an overclocking friend.
Originally Posted by Tim S I get flak from both pools of fanboys - just yesterday I read a thread on another forum suggesting that I'd written a number of "paid for by Nvidia" reviews and now this. Yes, just to satisfy your conspiracy theory, ATI has a department similar to NSA Homeland Security that poisons my mind and makes me write nice things about their products. Heh.
But anyway... let's get back to reality: as the saying goes, if you're getting flak from both sides, you must be pretty close to the truth. So I guess I should say, err, thanks.
I read your final thoughts page instead of just seeing the list of cards reviewed, and I do apologize. you were actually completely honest.
Sorry to the "hippy friend" there, *Gremlin, xI can't see your name right nowx, but yes, you were correct - too.
Comments 51 to 71 of 71
ReplyIts been such a long time that it has happened i don't think amd knows what to do with it, as a matter of fact has amd owned the performance crown yet in the GPU, market or is this the first time since it took over ati that it has.
Love seeing ati on top, roll on nvidia's response, i want to see where these 2 giants push the boundaries....AMD FTW HOOOOOORAH!
peace
fatman
Sidenote: A post on the forums with a chart for GPU(card) to monitor size(resolution) would be lovely. It's a bloody mess to figure out what to buy.
yup, not until the die shrink atleast and even then it would probably be more of a 260x2.
not true, 483 is the complete system, not the graphicscard. however, you can have a max of 2, there is only one crossfire connector on the cards, so 3 of them woudnt work.
yup, first time since amd bought ati.
nvidia's response atm is dropping the prices (except in uk of course), no faster card around for immediate release.
the 4870x2 looks nice but unable to turn off the CF means not so usefull for folding and i have allways been sole believer in uber fast single cards for an long time and the 9800GX2 is not makeing me want to use SLI (like the 8800GTX owner for 2 years), like SLI you cant know if the CF is working right, and like the 9800GX2 just not stable and consistant (GTX 280 for me as that is an step up from an 8800gtx, the 4870 is more like an small step up from an 9800gtx) i just leave the other 9800GX2 in my second slot for folding 3xGPU on the GTX280 as well (1200w TT toughpower) i can allso put the PyisX onto one of the 9800GX2 cards
all the above may be my fault with SLI not working as well (i can think of 3 things, upgraded mobo but did not reload, CPU mite be broke as it not OC any more or the mobo is half broke, maybe this Striker extreme 1 mobo is crap as not been likeing me ever the Upto date BIOS is no better then the older ones) very sure this does this on vista boot drive as well
i realy would like to buy the 4870x2 as all of my Lower end pcs are all AMD (chipset as well) but its the folding part that leads me away
need to lose this motherboard get an new one as i been mostly limited now on my low speed q6600 now (my amd dual core clocked at 3.3ghz is faster then q6600@2.4) goign to make an new topic for that one
Dell
:D
It's just amazing to me - and this of course is not about just this review, but nearly everyone I've seen. I guess one just doesn't notice it at all offhand.
When the 4870x2 is reviewed, suddenly, SLI setups are absolutely and completely 100% forgotten - as if they don't exist at all - as if they never have.
On the other hand, if the 260 or the 280 is being reviewed, all sort of crossfire configs suddenly appear, and of course for a long time now the 4870x2, and then of course there are questions and endless queries as to why the 260 or 280 is shamed and beaten down...
I mean it is absolutely ASTOUNDING to me.
Now that the 295 (4870x2) killer has hit, I can hardly wait to see the next round of supremely biased tricks, that the mindless masses will drool, drink, and repeat.
I already seen the red 4870x2 fans going into a blanching disbelief mode at the review results.
Let's see, when we test the 9800gx2, we put the 4850 crossfire against it, the 4870 x2 even combos of 4870 CF 512+1024 , but somehow the 4870x2 get the "single card test favor" ONLY.
It's like so much poppycock - i'm just ready to beat the tar out of something. Oh what a great trick, oh that was so masterful, what a wonderful, wonderful review...
Ok, that's all I had to say, and I was not being sarcastic about the intellect I notice across the pond - it's there, and I thoroughly enjoy it. I'm sure the review is great (oh gawd... ok I can't lie very well I'M SURE THE REVIEW IS GREATLY BIASED)
Jiminy crickets.
I think ATI put some new NSA homeland security "designer mind control drug" in the pcb of the ATI cards - yes it's a nasty and invasive experiment but so far it's results have been a huge success !
Good day !
What they need is some form of pin header where you can put whatever you want on it :)
I get flak from both pools of fanboys - just yesterday I read a thread on another forum suggesting that I'd written a number of "paid for by Nvidia" reviews and now this. Yes, just to satisfy your conspiracy theory, ATI has a department similar to NSA Homeland Security that poisons my mind and makes me write nice things about their products. Heh.
But anyway... let's get back to reality: as the saying goes, if you're getting flak from both sides, you must be pretty close to the truth. So I guess I should say, err, thanks.
i actually like that you lot say it how it is and **** what others think if only more people were like that tbh
I must say when I first read your reply I wasn't convinced, but I went and checked some of the other reviews on vidcards - and this site does do a lot better than many others.
I agree with you. I saw one site yesterday that was fair - and thanked the guy (the editor in fact) for not towing an agenda. I guess you just lucked out with me seeing your review first when I got here. There are a lot of haters for the top dog that took their money before ATI caught up. A LOT of them.
_____________________________________________________________________
I'm not a normal fanboy, Honesty is my company, so for those bleeding red... (I'd write words against green fanboys but they are quite uncommon or diminutive - in fact, they act like they agree most of the time - so there are plenty of conventional understanding lies out there.)
Cuda, PhysX, NVidia did the 2 cards on one chip first (way back in voodoo2 days) not ATI. The GTX295 is not a greedy swipe for the crown, it is a service to those with single slot 16x boards, and even SLI boards with only 2 slots - and anyone that dislikes CCC but wants massive speed - or bragging rights.
Since the GTX260 is only 1-3 watts higher in 3d and 15-30 watts lower in 2d/idle, the GTX260 has better power characteristics than the 4870 - so no the 4870 doesn't beat it with less power.
The GTX295 however, DOES do that to the 4870x2.
If Nvidia is losing money on their GT200 cores and ATI can drop their prices on the 700/770 then whom is really getting gouged now ? :D Yes, thank you ati for competing and dropping NV's high prices, but if you really can go lower so much easier, why didn't you destroy NV? - we know why....
I'm all for telling the truth.
The 4870 is an awesome card, as well as it's x2 version, but that doesn't mean lying every chance one gets to make it better is the right thing to do - so claiming it wins because 2560 aa af is cool (and often unplayable especially the $1500 moniors) doesn't cut it for honesty, either.
________________________________________________________________________
Just a few things that were already stuck far under my craw when I got here. If you're honest you'll easily admit there's a lot of red fan and a lot of green hate going on. When there's a chance to hurt the top dog that had such high prices for so long, a lot of people will do almost anything to "make it happen".
Take a look at my posting numbers, and cool off.
I agreee with the fellow - in fact I looked at a few other reviews and this site is not doing what others do as far as the little time I looked.
I jumped perhaps too quickly ( not that he excused my points, he didn't - but I can understand when other reviews here cover what I complained about )
I think this is a great site now - I see the reviews are plenty, I've always liked the /Aussiebrit intellect, and I've sent a link to an overclocking friend.
Don't get all juiced! :'(
I read your final thoughts page instead of just seeing the list of cards reviewed, and I do apologize. you were actually completely honest.
Sorry to the "hippy friend" there, *Gremlin, xI can't see your name right nowx, but yes, you were correct - too.
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