Originally Posted by i7lova Obviously if you have to have a pr guy come onto a comments section and defend your product then something is wrong. If it was so great and so awesome winning awards left and right then who cares what one review site thinks right? Like everyone else has said I like bit-tech because they are honest and some people dont like that (pr guys @ coolit *cough cough*). I will def. be passing on this product as it offers not better performance over air colling and for more money. No thanks.
Justifiable, I've seen better products fail because of word mouth, and a bad rap. (See: Vista)
Products like this have no place in the real-world cooling market.
There are good reasons why Intel and AMD produce CPUs which are designed to work within the TDP envelope of safe, compatible, risk-free aircooling - They need these products to work with the lowest common denominator of cooling systems for reasons of marketability.
Processors (whether CPUs or GPUs) don't need watercooling until they're being pushed hard via overclocking and this simply does not happen outside of the realm of the enthusiast.
The argument that products like this (and I mean all of these self-contained watercooling systems, not just the Domino ALC) are some sort of step-up for a budding enthusiast moving from air-cooling to watercooling is a laughable one.
Enthusiasts don't need training-wheels and every enthusiast forum out there will still give the advice "Don't waste your money on premade stuff, custom gear is better and you'll learn more from it for future builds".
Buying a premade watercooling system is conceptually akin to buying a premade PC and thus runs counter to the very ideals that keep the entire enthusiast community going.
On top of that, anyone who cares enough to get the better-than-air performance out of their processor will also care enough to invest time and money in a proper watercooling system.
(pistol_pete summed up the reasons for this perfectly above)
Watercooling is something for enthusiasts for reasons of its very function and design that a mainstream, premade system is unlikely to ever rectify. (Leakage risks, case compatibility, space-consumption and the 'overkill' factor)
Not all 'jumps' in a learning curve are undesirable and not all gaps in a market need to be filled, nor can be successfully - Especially with a market as generally well-informed and well-reviewed as that of the computer enthusiast.
Bad products just won't cut it and the close scrutiny that we demand as informed consumers from sites like bit-tech will show up the flaws of any product.
...And that's exactly what happened here, simple as that.
Originally Posted by vanu I'm not quite sure who is telling the truth but if the first samples were preproduction ones it seems very unprofessional to include the impressions gathered from them in the final product review...
How can it be good though if CoolIT sends out FOUR pre-production units that all fail within the short time bi-tech reviews them? (short compared to how long a enduser will expect a product to last).
The Intel comparison is not really valid, or do you know of any instance where intel sent out four faulty ES Cpu's half a year after product launch?
Besides, if CoolITs target audience for the Domino are indeed the noobs with no clue about watercooling, then that is all the more reason for it to built extra sturdy, but they obviously did not.
naokaji, I'm not convinced they were pre-production units because the Domino ALC has been 'out there' since 18th December (see my above post). I seriously doubt there was a six month period where the ALC was in a pre-production state after it was announced on CoolIT's website and reviewed by at least one US-based site.
Originally Posted by Zurechial Products like this have no place in the real-world cooling market.
lol, are you for real? This is a working water cooler which performs on par with the some of the best air coolers. If the price was $10 lower, the fan a little bit quieter, the build quality better - I doubt that it wouldn't be a bestseller.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zurechial
On top of that, anyone who cares enough to get the better-than-air performance out of their processor will also care enough to invest time and money in a proper watercooling system.
yeah, right, why bother with water, go freon instead! ;) If I can have 4ghz on air, I wouldn't bother with water just to get 4.4Ghz, I'd save the money for my next CPU...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zurechial ...And that's exactly what happened here, simple as that.
What happened here is that CoolIt has made a compromise with performance in favor of price. A better fan (or two instead of one), maybe a better pump and so on, at the same price, would be a winner.
Originally Posted by Zurechial Products like this have no place in the real-world cooling market.
lol, are you for real? This is a working water cooler which performs on par with the some of the best air coolers. If the price was $10 lower, the fan a little bit quieter, the build quality better - I doubt that it wouldn't be a bestseller.
Zurechial is correct. CoolIT say the product will never need to be topped up, that is a load of crap, no matter how airtight or contained the unit is it will lose fluid over time. In a few years time when your pump burns out and your CPU fries due to their being no fluid in the loop, you need to replace the CPU and they buy another unit.
You could buy a decent liquid cooling solution for the price of the broken system plus the new one you would have to buy, not to mention the cash you would have to spend on a new CPU. At least with a decent kit you can always upgrade and add pieces to suit any cooling situation.
You say that "This is a working water cooler which performs on par with the some of the best air coolers.", you may be true but the true function of water cooling is for it to perform better and work quieter than air coolers. This CoolIT system can compete with and beat high end air coolers but will make your ears bleed in the process. Why pay twice a much for a cooler that is much noisier and performs a couple of degrees better than a decent air cooler. If you didn't care about the noise you could get a TRUE120 and bolt 2 100+cfm Panaflows to it and it will demolish this cooler by a long run and save you a lot of cash.
Water cooling is all about providing near ambient temps for a low noise output. You find me an self contained unit that can keep my 8800GTX and my Q6600 at 36c load and I may consider it. This is not water cooling, this is exactly the same deal a people buying Thermaltake and other self contained units, it's all about the e-penis of having water cooling. The unit may work well for a low end C2D or a low end AMD system but considering everyone who water cools has top end tech and OCs the balls out of it, units like this have no place in the real world cooling market, unless you take Bindi's point into consideration.
Originally Posted by Bindibadgi I disagree. There is a place for it in autonomous builds for system integrators.
This I can agree with, so then let me rephrase and state that I don't believe there's a place for products like this in the retail, end-user market.
Let it be solely something for system-builders like Dell to use in their XPS gaming systems or whatever.
My point that it's a gap in the retail market filled needlessly still stands. :p
Originally Posted by Zurechial This I can agree with, so then let me rephrase and state that I don't believe there's a place for products like this in the retail, end-user market.
Let it be solely something for system-builders like Dell to use in their XPS gaming systems or whatever.
My point that that it's a gap in the retail market filled needlessly still stands. :p
+1
kits like this are so that people who bought their XPS can say they have watercooling, the type of person who will probably never check system temps their entire lives.
For CoolIT to first of all think bit-tech would give the thing a 100% thumbs up was foolish to say the least. to then come on the forums and try to argue the point with us forumites was positively retarded, we know what we like and we know what we want. the average pc enthusiast reads more PR bull in a day than any politician i'd wager and i dont even see it anymore to be honest, my brain blanks it out.
the gap in the market is there, but i would argue that CoolIT are exploiting a market segment rather than providing a much needed product. where air cooling will do the job (95% of applications) water cooling is an uneccesary (and potentially dangerous) commodity. to try and build that commodity to such a low cost is never going to work lets face it.
Originally Posted by thehippoz hehe bindi's all- it was a hundred dollar bill and a bottle of hooch.. I passed :D
Nay, I reckon they offered to slap on a wig and some make-up, on that poor PR guy, and make him literally work his ass off!!, No wonder Bit-Tech didn't take the bait
I have this and also use the CoolIt DUALBAY DRIVE GPU setup for my ASUS 2 x 4870.I get the same results with in +- 2-3c as test set up.The one problem i have is that the OC that i can get with my current I7 920 is beyond what this cooler can do.If you are good with 3.6-3.8ish then this will work great for you.But if you want or can get a higher OC like i can this turned out to be a wate of $ i should have put the $80 in to a better cooling setup.I have a friend that does use this on his Q9450 and works great but is just not the best I7 choice out there right now.This is a good product for a basic OC for a person that does not have the time or knowledge to run a full water setup.
Originally Posted by jamesadean Just to be clear (representing CoolIT PR)... there are no issues with the barbs on Dominos available for sale - hence actually buying a unit from YOYOTech and bringing over to bit-tech. We also made bit-tech aware that there was an issue with the initial replacement samples and not to use them for review, basically down to a mess up in shipping direct from North America.
Also, price wise, the MAXIMUM you'll pay from a mainstream e-tailer is £77 inc VAT. The price is actually more along the lines of £68 - £74. The RRP is £74.99 inc VAT, so unsure why the price quoted is actually higher.
There are some fantastic benefits to water cooling at this level. It isn't designed for the all-out enthusiast, and we feel we made that clear from the start. But for someone who likes the idea of getting into the water cooling scene, the Domino is a great start and performs extremely well.
Granted it may cost a tad more than a similar performing air cooler, but that's not water cooling... is it! But you do get the benefits of speed control, reducing the ambient temp of your PC by exhausting heat directly out the back, taking weight off the motherboard and the added bonus of performance control, LCD screen showing coolant temps, fan speed and pump speeds and a warning system in the unlikely case of a failure.
Dell, Apple, Commodore, Cyberpower US, BFG Phobos (and the massively growing numbers of UK PC builders) can't all be wrong! Nor can over 40 other review sites and magazines who either gave the Domino an award or a glowingly positive review!
Where do you get your information about your statement; "there are no issues with the barbs".
Because there are issues; go to amazon and search for the Domino ALC; you will see people who bought this having their systems destroyed by the barb for the hose going into the radiator letting go and dumping the water coolant into their systems. The more I have looked the more cases of the very same thing happening over and over...
Some have taken pictures of this including the defective - cheap barb used for the hose to radiator. They are breaking off where they enter the radiator and that is a DESIGN FLAW.
Thing is COOLIT states they are SOL about getting their systems repaired due their product DOMINO ALC causing the damage; I hope they re read warranty laws about the USA since they are in Canada...
The auto makers and other companies found out other wise when they tried to use a restrictive warranty. If you are considering using this product I WOULD DO WAY MORE RESEARCH BEFORE USING IT; I wish I had; it would have saved my two month old computer....
My experience in using th Domino ALC was bad. To put it plainly IT FAILED. The barb - thin cheap plastic nipple on the hose going into the radiator failed and dumped the coolant into and shorted out my new computer.
I have pictures and I will try to post them here. I have also been in contact with COOLIT and was told they will not replace the damaged computer parts caused by their products failure. I was told they would replace the defective item with one that DOES NOT LEAK? Would you take another "NON LEAKING UNIT FROM THEM?"
I was also told if I wanted to get my money back I will have to return it to the place where I bought it. I will be doing just that and informing this multimillion dollar company what happened and how I was treated by COOLIT.
I was also informed via e mail from COOLIT that if I want to damaged computer parts replaced to get a "RMA" from the stores I bought the parts from? Do they imply I have to lie to get these parts replaced by telling them they are defective? This means COOLIT is having some one else pay for their products defect.
I lost the motherboard, CPU, MEMORY,and Video Card.
I am seeing more and more posts from people who bought this item having the same failure; where I bought this item there are no less than three people reporting the SAME EXACT FAILURE.....I am very sure COOLIT will not like this post and I have pictures and e mails from them and from me proving what I have posted.
I am more than willing to provide pictures and these e mails to people who have the same problem; we need to get together and either have COOLIT make right the damages their product cause or get COOLIT redesign this defect out of this product. Even here on Bit-Tech they suffered multiple failures of this item; I wish I had seen this before buying it. The usable parts left in my two month old computer is the case, powersupply, DVDRW, and media reader.
Comments 51 to 67 of 67
ReplyJustifiable, I've seen better products fail because of word mouth, and a bad rap. (See: Vista)
There are good reasons why Intel and AMD produce CPUs which are designed to work within the TDP envelope of safe, compatible, risk-free aircooling - They need these products to work with the lowest common denominator of cooling systems for reasons of marketability.
Processors (whether CPUs or GPUs) don't need watercooling until they're being pushed hard via overclocking and this simply does not happen outside of the realm of the enthusiast.
The argument that products like this (and I mean all of these self-contained watercooling systems, not just the Domino ALC) are some sort of step-up for a budding enthusiast moving from air-cooling to watercooling is a laughable one.
Enthusiasts don't need training-wheels and every enthusiast forum out there will still give the advice "Don't waste your money on premade stuff, custom gear is better and you'll learn more from it for future builds".
Buying a premade watercooling system is conceptually akin to buying a premade PC and thus runs counter to the very ideals that keep the entire enthusiast community going.
On top of that, anyone who cares enough to get the better-than-air performance out of their processor will also care enough to invest time and money in a proper watercooling system.
(pistol_pete summed up the reasons for this perfectly above)
Watercooling is something for enthusiasts for reasons of its very function and design that a mainstream, premade system is unlikely to ever rectify. (Leakage risks, case compatibility, space-consumption and the 'overkill' factor)
Not all 'jumps' in a learning curve are undesirable and not all gaps in a market need to be filled, nor can be successfully - Especially with a market as generally well-informed and well-reviewed as that of the computer enthusiast.
Bad products just won't cut it and the close scrutiny that we demand as informed consumers from sites like bit-tech will show up the flaws of any product.
...And that's exactly what happened here, simple as that.
How can it be good though if CoolIT sends out FOUR pre-production units that all fail within the short time bi-tech reviews them? (short compared to how long a enduser will expect a product to last).
The Intel comparison is not really valid, or do you know of any instance where intel sent out four faulty ES Cpu's half a year after product launch?
Besides, if CoolITs target audience for the Domino are indeed the noobs with no clue about watercooling, then that is all the more reason for it to built extra sturdy, but they obviously did not.
lol, are you for real? This is a working water cooler which performs on par with the some of the best air coolers. If the price was $10 lower, the fan a little bit quieter, the build quality better - I doubt that it wouldn't be a bestseller.
yeah, right, why bother with water, go freon instead! ;) If I can have 4ghz on air, I wouldn't bother with water just to get 4.4Ghz, I'd save the money for my next CPU...
What happened here is that CoolIt has made a compromise with performance in favor of price. A better fan (or two instead of one), maybe a better pump and so on, at the same price, would be a winner.
I disagree. There is a place for it in autonomous builds for system integrators.
Zurechial is correct. CoolIT say the product will never need to be topped up, that is a load of crap, no matter how airtight or contained the unit is it will lose fluid over time. In a few years time when your pump burns out and your CPU fries due to their being no fluid in the loop, you need to replace the CPU and they buy another unit.
You could buy a decent liquid cooling solution for the price of the broken system plus the new one you would have to buy, not to mention the cash you would have to spend on a new CPU. At least with a decent kit you can always upgrade and add pieces to suit any cooling situation.
You say that "This is a working water cooler which performs on par with the some of the best air coolers.", you may be true but the true function of water cooling is for it to perform better and work quieter than air coolers. This CoolIT system can compete with and beat high end air coolers but will make your ears bleed in the process. Why pay twice a much for a cooler that is much noisier and performs a couple of degrees better than a decent air cooler. If you didn't care about the noise you could get a TRUE120 and bolt 2 100+cfm Panaflows to it and it will demolish this cooler by a long run and save you a lot of cash.
Water cooling is all about providing near ambient temps for a low noise output. You find me an self contained unit that can keep my 8800GTX and my Q6600 at 36c load and I may consider it. This is not water cooling, this is exactly the same deal a people buying Thermaltake and other self contained units, it's all about the e-penis of having water cooling. The unit may work well for a low end C2D or a low end AMD system but considering everyone who water cools has top end tech and OCs the balls out of it, units like this have no place in the real world cooling market, unless you take Bindi's point into consideration.
This I can agree with, so then let me rephrase and state that I don't believe there's a place for products like this in the retail, end-user market.
Let it be solely something for system-builders like Dell to use in their XPS gaming systems or whatever.
My point that it's a gap in the retail market filled needlessly still stands. :p
+1
kits like this are so that people who bought their XPS can say they have watercooling, the type of person who will probably never check system temps their entire lives.
For CoolIT to first of all think bit-tech would give the thing a 100% thumbs up was foolish to say the least. to then come on the forums and try to argue the point with us forumites was positively retarded, we know what we like and we know what we want. the average pc enthusiast reads more PR bull in a day than any politician i'd wager and i dont even see it anymore to be honest, my brain blanks it out.
the gap in the market is there, but i would argue that CoolIT are exploiting a market segment rather than providing a much needed product. where air cooling will do the job (95% of applications) water cooling is an uneccesary (and potentially dangerous) commodity. to try and build that commodity to such a low cost is never going to work lets face it.
hehe bindi's all- it was a hundred dollar bill and a bottle of hooch.. I passed :D
Nay, I reckon they offered to slap on a wig and some make-up, on that poor PR guy, and make him literally work his ass off!!, No wonder Bit-Tech didn't take the bait
Where do you get your information about your statement; "there are no issues with the barbs".
Because there are issues; go to amazon and search for the Domino ALC; you will see people who bought this having their systems destroyed by the barb for the hose going into the radiator letting go and dumping the water coolant into their systems. The more I have looked the more cases of the very same thing happening over and over...
Some have taken pictures of this including the defective - cheap barb used for the hose to radiator. They are breaking off where they enter the radiator and that is a DESIGN FLAW.
Thing is COOLIT states they are SOL about getting their systems repaired due their product DOMINO ALC causing the damage; I hope they re read warranty laws about the USA since they are in Canada...
The auto makers and other companies found out other wise when they tried to use a restrictive warranty. If you are considering using this product I WOULD DO WAY MORE RESEARCH BEFORE USING IT; I wish I had; it would have saved my two month old computer....
I have pictures and I will try to post them here. I have also been in contact with COOLIT and was told they will not replace the damaged computer parts caused by their products failure. I was told they would replace the defective item with one that DOES NOT LEAK? Would you take another "NON LEAKING UNIT FROM THEM?"
I was also told if I wanted to get my money back I will have to return it to the place where I bought it. I will be doing just that and informing this multimillion dollar company what happened and how I was treated by COOLIT.
I was also informed via e mail from COOLIT that if I want to damaged computer parts replaced to get a "RMA" from the stores I bought the parts from? Do they imply I have to lie to get these parts replaced by telling them they are defective? This means COOLIT is having some one else pay for their products defect.
I lost the motherboard, CPU, MEMORY,and Video Card.
I am seeing more and more posts from people who bought this item having the same failure; where I bought this item there are no less than three people reporting the SAME EXACT FAILURE.....I am very sure COOLIT will not like this post and I have pictures and e mails from them and from me proving what I have posted.
I am more than willing to provide pictures and these e mails to people who have the same problem; we need to get together and either have COOLIT make right the damages their product cause or get COOLIT redesign this defect out of this product. Even here on Bit-Tech they suffered multiple failures of this item; I wish I had seen this before buying it. The usable parts left in my two month old computer is the case, powersupply, DVDRW, and media reader.
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