FYI Everyone We're about to make an article addendum and add two more pages - one was a Leadtek GTX 280 which arrived this morning (it's stock clocked and since we had three ATI cards we're featuring this too) and the Power Consumption results too because people asked for it, so we tested it. This doesn't affect the scores.
Originally Posted by Bindibadgi We will be doing an SLI and CrossFire article soon.
Awesome! This is where I am kind of stuck. With my EVGA 750i board I am locked into buying nvidia, and using SLI as a graphics upgrade solution. Decided this because it seemed like that's what the market has driven it to. So I have one 8800GT and I am looking to get the second card. I hope I don't find out from the upcoming article that I need buy two new ones instead,
Originally Posted by Bindibadgi FYI Everyone We're about to make an article addendum and add two more pages - one was a Leadtek GTX 280 which arrived this morning (it's stock clocked and since we had three ATI cards we're featuring this too) and the Power Consumption results too because people asked for it, so we tested it. This doesn't affect the scores.
EDIT: Extra pages are up, guys.
I've seen a fair amount of speculation that the reason the 4850 and 4870 suck so much at idle is because Powerplay isn't working properly. Would also explain why they're so hot idle (well, that and the fact that ATi have set the fan speeds to incredibly low settings)... of course, time will tell on the Powerplay front. Maybe newer drivers will fix it, maybe it'll need a BIOS flash. Dunno.
Feels so good that ATi finally got back in the game (fanboy, I'm sorry). I think it might be the best if people just buy ATi for a while, even if it isn't as good as nVidia (which clearly isn't the case now) as I see every buck going to nVidia would go into big bag that might get opened when ATi makes a good card again, but is going to stay locked away otherwise (I know I'm exaggerating, but go with me), while every buck going to ATi will be spend to make a stronger R&D department so they can keep nVidia on their toes (so long ATi doesn't get cocky like it and AMD did the last time and the cash won't be used to try and keep a dying CPU manufacturer alive for a while (that is if AMD's CPU business is really dying, haven't been following it to much recently really)). I know this is half my fan boy speaking but I think it would make sense that we try and avoid a nVidia monopoly at all cost, just look at how cocky they are when they still have competition, imagine what it would be like when they had no competitors (and I don't think Intel's Larrabee is going to much more the a low-mid end GPU with high processing power). Also nice to see ATi got their AA problems under control and even better than nVidia because that was on of the trade marks of ATi (hot, slow but looking good).
PS to GUNBLADE just wait for the 4870 X2, that will go just fine on a nVidia board (I think) and a little birdie told me that it would perform up to 30% faster that a regular Crossfire arrangement. (Tho beware, the birdie looked kind of suspicious, FudZilla).
Wow, beast of a review. That must have taken months to get pulled together. Perfectly readable, though! Thanks for the excellent work, and I'm looking forward to the SLI/Crossfire sequel!
Originally Posted by EmJay Wow, beast of a review. That must have taken months to get pulled together. Perfectly readable, though! Thanks for the excellent work, and I'm looking forward to the SLI/Crossfire sequel!
We worked it out and it's taken 2 people working about 60 hours each and one working ~24 over 5 days to put it together
To say we were looking forward to the weekend today is an understatement ha!
We really really appreciate all the kind comments though - it keeps us going to do the next one! :)
Originally Posted by Bindibadgi We worked it out and it's taken 2 people working about 60 hours each and one working ~24 over 5 days to put it together
To say we were looking forward to the weekend today is an understatement ha!
We really really appreciate all the kind comments though - it keeps us going to do the next one! :)
Yes, a truly excellent review and well worth the wait! The work put in really shows. Thank-you Bit-Tech!!!!
Think I'll be getting a 4870, but am I the only one thinking of waiting until we see some custom/aftermarket cooling? I Wonder if HIS will do the usual IceQ business with the 4870.
this card is very good
makes me want to use my server mobo (M3A32-MVP Deluxe) and slap in 2x4870 in there (only let down is the CPU as its an X4 9850 not an intel cpu at 3.4ghz, i Still cant get my CPU to be desktop stable beyeond 2.4ghz {see SIG})
makes me wunder why i just got an second 8800gtx (but i allready had an 8800gtx so it was worth it for £120), replaced me PSU with an TK 1200W PSU and still cant oc the cpu so cpu mite be naff or the mobo is
4850 for the price it is its very fast 2 of them in CF seems very impressive be even better once we get the CF results form BT only downside with ATI on the 4850 is lackluster fan options needing to use XML file to contole the fan speeds(or more to the point Why we are needing to contole the fan speed in the first place), the 4870 does not have this problem (dual slot cooler)
the only let down with any 2xxx to 4xxx cards is Folding, yes it mate be very stable but 1 of my 8800gt cards gets 3-4x more perfomace then an any of them, hopefuly when thay bring out bigger work units (or Fix the core) thay can get them 800 SP working away
Nice article :) I'm still on the fence for a new card even after all that though.
Sounds like a 4850 would probably be somewhere in the region of 4-6x the performance of my current 7800GT? and in most respects a clear winner for a single card running 1680*1050.
Before I could actually decide and commit I'd need to get an idea of a bit more though - firstly being which companies warranties are voided by proper installation of a water block (I have the current card from Club3d because Tim said at the time they'd not void a warranty for it) which I have yet to see really publicised by any of them and the second being how well they tend to overclock. I know G92 seems to clock quite well since the default coolers seem to be a limiting factor but I've yet to hear that much about the new ati cards, beyond running hot and doing very poorly at overclocking with the default cooler.
There's also my divided loyalties I guess, I've an SLI board and always gotten on well with nvidia cards, but I've always liked AMD processors (mostly helped by them offering that much extra performance for the money back in the day from the athlon on)
Can I do CrossfireX between a 3870 and a 4870? Right now I've got a 3870 and would like a 4870. It wont limit the performance of the 4870 if I have the 4870 as the primary card will it? I thought the new 'CrossfireX' was supposed to allow cards to run in crossfire at full speed or something.
Originally Posted by Baz don't count on it - the gtx280 die is bloody enormous, so chip yields are low and thus the price is high. If Nvidia were to agressivly slash prices,they'd be losing money very quickly.
They wouldn't lose much really, high end cards are a tiny part of the overall volume of sales. And prices have already dropped enormously, from $650 to $430 Cdn. in the short time since launch.
Originally Posted by talladega got a question bout these new ati cards.
Can I do CrossfireX between a 3870 and a 4870? Right now I've got a 3870 and would like a 4870. It wont limit the performance of the 4870 if I have the 4870 as the primary card will it? I thought the new 'CrossfireX' was supposed to allow cards to run in crossfire at full speed or something.
I have 2 x 4850's installed, and room for 2 more, however all the indications seem to be that 3 or 4 cards offer little benefit (except in synthetic benchmarks) and in some circumstances the performance actually drops.
Very interesting article on the current state of video cards. I was hoping to see something like this, as things have been changing very rapidly. Just six months ago I bought a 8800 GT, which seemed like a steal at the time. Now, all these new cards out perform it. To be expected, but not so soon.
Now, this may be a dumb or even silly question, but since it was noted that the difference between the GT 280 and the 4870 varied wildly depending on the game and settings, would it be possible to get both, put them in a motherboard that supports two PCIE x16 cards and not run SLI or Crossfire (of course). Then each game or app could be used on the monitor attached to the card that supports it best.
This is based on a dream of someone with a load of cash and time on their hands, which in reality I have neither. Just wondering.
I have 2 x 4850's installed, and room for 2 more, however all the indications seem to be that 3 or 4 cards offer little benefit (except in synthetic benchmarks) and in some circumstances the performance actually drops.
dang....
hmm supposedly you can use any aftermarket cooler on a 4870 that works on a 3870. Can anyone confirm this to be true? More specifically I would want to use an EK Waterblock from my 3870 if I were to get a 4870.
This is great way to go ATI, but it did feel like the reviewers were a little bias towards nVidia but ehh anyhow I think overall ATI should be the real winner here, I mean price to performance alone is amazing. I cant wait for their 4870x2 to hit the market. :)
hmm supposedly you can use any aftermarket cooler on a 4870 that works on a 3870. Can anyone confirm this to be true? More specifically I would want to use an EK Waterblock from my 3870 if I were to get a 4870.
They put a Thermalright HR-03 GT on a 4870 and apparently it fits perfectly. If you scroll down you will see how cool it keeps a 4870, pretty impressive!
Originally Posted by HourBeforeDawn This is great way to go ATI, but it did feel like the reviewers were a little bias towards nVidia but ehh anyhow I think overall ATI should be the real winner here, I mean price to performance alone is amazing. I cant wait for their 4870x2 to hit the market. :)
???
We gave two awards out of two - an excellence which we issue less than 10 a year of, and a recommended to ATI products.
Comments 51 to 75 of 83
EDIT: Extra pages are up, guys.
Awesome! This is where I am kind of stuck. With my EVGA 750i board I am locked into buying nvidia, and using SLI as a graphics upgrade solution. Decided this because it seemed like that's what the market has driven it to. So I have one 8800GT and I am looking to get the second card. I hope I don't find out from the upcoming article that I need buy two new ones instead,
I've seen a fair amount of speculation that the reason the 4850 and 4870 suck so much at idle is because Powerplay isn't working properly. Would also explain why they're so hot idle (well, that and the fact that ATi have set the fan speeds to incredibly low settings)... of course, time will tell on the Powerplay front. Maybe newer drivers will fix it, maybe it'll need a BIOS flash. Dunno.
PS to GUNBLADE just wait for the 4870 X2, that will go just fine on a nVidia board (I think) and a little birdie told me that it would perform up to 30% faster that a regular Crossfire arrangement. (Tho beware, the birdie looked kind of suspicious, FudZilla).
By the way Owesome review! keep up the good work!
We worked it out and it's taken 2 people working about 60 hours each and one working ~24 over 5 days to put it together
To say we were looking forward to the weekend today is an understatement ha!
We really really appreciate all the kind comments though - it keeps us going to do the next one! :)
Yes, a truly excellent review and well worth the wait! The work put in really shows. Thank-you Bit-Tech!!!!
Think I'll be getting a 4870, but am I the only one thinking of waiting until we see some custom/aftermarket cooling? I Wonder if HIS will do the usual IceQ business with the 4870.
makes me want to use my server mobo (M3A32-MVP Deluxe) and slap in 2x4870 in there (only let down is the CPU as its an X4 9850 not an intel cpu at 3.4ghz, i Still cant get my CPU to be desktop stable beyeond 2.4ghz {see SIG})
makes me wunder why i just got an second 8800gtx (but i allready had an 8800gtx so it was worth it for £120), replaced me PSU with an TK 1200W PSU and still cant oc the cpu so cpu mite be naff or the mobo is
4850 for the price it is its very fast 2 of them in CF seems very impressive be even better once we get the CF results form BT only downside with ATI on the 4850 is lackluster fan options needing to use XML file to contole the fan speeds(or more to the point Why we are needing to contole the fan speed in the first place), the 4870 does not have this problem (dual slot cooler)
the only let down with any 2xxx to 4xxx cards is Folding, yes it mate be very stable but 1 of my 8800gt cards gets 3-4x more perfomace then an any of them, hopefuly when thay bring out bigger work units (or Fix the core) thay can get them 800 SP working away
Sounds like a 4850 would probably be somewhere in the region of 4-6x the performance of my current 7800GT? and in most respects a clear winner for a single card running 1680*1050.
Before I could actually decide and commit I'd need to get an idea of a bit more though - firstly being which companies warranties are voided by proper installation of a water block (I have the current card from Club3d because Tim said at the time they'd not void a warranty for it) which I have yet to see really publicised by any of them and the second being how well they tend to overclock. I know G92 seems to clock quite well since the default coolers seem to be a limiting factor but I've yet to hear that much about the new ati cards, beyond running hot and doing very poorly at overclocking with the default cooler.
There's also my divided loyalties I guess, I've an SLI board and always gotten on well with nvidia cards, but I've always liked AMD processors (mostly helped by them offering that much extra performance for the money back in the day from the athlon on)
Gah!
Can I do CrossfireX between a 3870 and a 4870? Right now I've got a 3870 and would like a 4870. It wont limit the performance of the 4870 if I have the 4870 as the primary card will it? I thought the new 'CrossfireX' was supposed to allow cards to run in crossfire at full speed or something.
Someone wanna tell me how it would work?
No, you can only crossfire between the current generations of each GPU. Check out http://game.amd.com/us-en/content/images/crossfirex/CF_combo_chart_July08.jpg
I have 2 x 4850's installed, and room for 2 more, however all the indications seem to be that 3 or 4 cards offer little benefit (except in synthetic benchmarks) and in some circumstances the performance actually drops.
it can do AA as well now
It depends on how much time we have to be honest, and how flacky the drivers are.
Now, this may be a dumb or even silly question, but since it was noted that the difference between the GT 280 and the 4870 varied wildly depending on the game and settings, would it be possible to get both, put them in a motherboard that supports two PCIE x16 cards and not run SLI or Crossfire (of course). Then each game or app could be used on the monitor attached to the card that supports it best.
This is based on a dream of someone with a load of cash and time on their hands, which in reality I have neither. Just wondering.
dang....
hmm supposedly you can use any aftermarket cooler on a 4870 that works on a 3870. Can anyone confirm this to be true? More specifically I would want to use an EK Waterblock from my 3870 if I were to get a 4870.
Yeah check out this review of the Palit Radeon HD4870 - http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-reviews/8162-palit-radeon-hd4870-512mb-graphics-card-review-21.html
They put a Thermalright HR-03 GT on a 4870 and apparently it fits perfectly. If you scroll down you will see how cool it keeps a 4870, pretty impressive!
???
We gave two awards out of two - an excellence which we issue less than 10 a year of, and a recommended to ATI products.
:?