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A Week With Windows 8

Posted on 28th Apr 2013 at 16:26 by Antony Leather with 91 comments

Antony Leather
Windows 7 was largely well received from the moment it was released. It looked and felt a lot like XP and Vista, but with some noticeable and useful tweaks including everything from Snap (aligning two windows side by side in a matter of seconds) to Snipping tool and decent SSD support. It’s little wonder, then, that Windows 7 sold very well indeed.

With Windows 8, however, Microsoft has made the most significant visible changes to the OS that we’ve seen in over a decade, and most reviews have been far less glowing. So when ordering my new laptop the plan was to install Windows 7 on it as soon as it arrived. But, not one to blindly take other people's word for it, when the laptop did arrive I thought I’d relent on my original plan and actually give Windows 8 a go for a week. Here’s how I got on.

As usual with new laptops, the OS is pre-installed so all you have to do is type in the usual blurb such as account name and WiFi password and away you go. Except it wasn’t quite that simple with Windows 8. With Windows 7, you can skip various steps such as Windows update settings and the like and just get to the desktop – useful if you know what you’re doing.

Windows 8 demanded that I jump through numerous hoops first, including entering my Hotmail account username and password, before it let me log on. Then, having set my preferred background colour, it decided to cycle through the full spectrum of other colours whilst completing the install. Pretty, but wholly unnecessary.

A Week With Windows 8
My Modern UI or 'Metro' screen after a few minutes of tinkering - it's alright but it's no desktop and taskbar. Click to enlarge

Eventually I landed at the infamous Metro UI. Now until this point I’d deliberately avoided Windows 8 systems I came across as I wanted to wait and see for myself what the OS was like during more than a fleeting glance. The first thing that struck me were the different sized icons – it just made for a cluttered look at the start and tiles as opposed to icons did take some getting used to. I set about re-arranging these and continued to do so till I’d cleared the way to begin installing my own applications.

The second thing that struck me is how often I found myself flitting between Metro and the desktop. Whenever you open a standard application, you’re transferred to the desktop, which, for a PC or non-touch-screen laptop owner seems like a waste of time to me. That's beside the issue that I ended up with apparently two different installations of Skype - one being the integrated Modern UI app, the other which I'd installed automatically using Ninite, which I reach for every time I deal with a fresh OS install.

Despite signing in on the desktop app version, my details hadn't been synced with the Modern UI one. Bizarre. Another little issue that absolutely infuriated me at first was that Windows 8’s swipe and other touch gestures were automatically assigned to my laptop’s touchpad.

I’ve never sworn at an operating system before but every flick of the pad seemed to tab me away from what I was doing to land at Metro or on another application. Eventually I disabled all gestures in the laptop’s touchpad control centre, although I did try the pinch to zoom function, which turned out to be a jerky mess compared to tablets and smartphones I’ve used, so that got canned too.

Using the Mail application from Metro was also a pain in the rear. It seemed overly-simplified to me, and it was a nightmare opening attachments. While I was out, I needed to view an attachment and then get back to the email while on a call with a courier company. It took far longer to fiddle around in Metro than it would have done on the desktop, with the main issue being it wasn’t obvious where files, attachments and such like were being opened and how to get at them.

Something I loved about Windows 7 was the enhanced search. I was initially stumped in Windows 8 but eventually found that instead of clicking in a search box, simply typing in Metro starts the search automatically. This is all well and good, but I still prefer clicking on icons, especially those pinned to the taskbar, to open regularly-used programs - okay maybe that's just a personal preference thing.

Then there’s the issue of shutting down or restarting. It’s probably the simplest but most utterly ridiculous issue in Windows 8. I prefer shutting my PC down because it means I can turn off hibernation and save a shedload of disk space on my SSD. Other people do it to save money on their electricity bills, so to add several layers of menus and the condescending-sounding Charm Bar to get at the power options was a serious no no. On a tablet you have the option of hitting the power button to be given an instant option to power down, but not so here.

Microsoft seems to have forgotten that for PC users, the PC power button is usually located under a desk, or two feet above it meaning it’s far more convenient to use the Start Button.

Having ironed out the more pressing issues I found with Windows 8, Metro is slowly growing on me but something I stand by is the fact that many tasks seem to take longer due to the constant switching between metro and the desktop, and multitasking in particular just seems frustrating in Metro, at least for newcomers.

You open an email attachment, but once you minimise the window, there’s nothing obvious about where to look to view it again. The Mail application was so laggy, that I often didn’t bother waiting to see whether a file type was a PDF or something else before trying to open it, and I often found myself clicking back into Mail to find it again. In contrast, on the desktop, Adobe Reader or Windows Photo Viewer would have popped up and would be sitting on the taskbar.

A Week With Windows 8
Start8 allows you to boot straight to the desktop instead of Modern UI and also reinstate the Start Button. Click to enlarge

There are of course numerous tips and tricks out there to get the Start Menu back and a whole load of other things, but I’m loathe to do too much of this as it will mean having to do it every time I reinstall the OS, which I tend to do a few times a year to clear things out. However, one simple option that at least allows you to use the Desktop as you used to - along with booting into it and also retaining a customisable Start Button - is Start8. In short, it's probably the best $5 I've ever spent. Funnily enough, system builders are including Start8 with new systems, most likely due to tech support calls asking where the Star Menu has gone.

I may stick with it for the time being, especially as Start8 seems to have got me back to roughly Windows 7 status, and of course, the next version of Windows has unsurprisingly reintroduced the Start Button. However, seeing as Windows 8 doesn’t really offer anything useful over Windows 7, for me anyway, I can quite easily see me reverting back at some point in the next week or so, especially as I mainly use my laptop for Word processing, web browsing and the usual communication stuff.

A Week With Windows 8
Start8's reinstated Start Button, complete with the normal shutdown options and search box. Click to enlarge

It isn't all bad, though. I can see how its ergonomics would suit a touchscreen device, but I think Microsoft has forgotten that a vast majority of machines that will be using Windows 8 won’t have this feature. I can still achieve more in the same time with a monitor, mouse and keyboard than I can on a touchscreen, and Windows 8 seems to go against the grain here by leaning towards a touch-orientated interface. You only have to look at Google with search terms such as Windows 8 Metro to see just how many people have similar misgivings.

Have you used Windows 8? What were your impressions? Have you found ways around any features you didn’t like? Let us know in the forum.

91 Comments

Discuss in the forums Reply
Maki role 28th April 2013, 17:54 Quote
Personally I've found Windows 8 to be very mixed. Whilst I didn't like the UI, that was simple enough to change and is now fine. What I hated though, was how Windows 8 destroyed all my audio input drivers, seemingly irreparably. I've tried uninstalling them, re-installing them, updating etc, nope. I can no longer use the mic and line-in ports on my motherboard now, which is frustrating beyond belief.

The only fix I've found so far is using a Griffin iMic to change the inputs to USB instead, which sees to function without a hitch. Luckily I had one lying about from my days as an iMac user. I can imagine a sound card of any variety would also do the trick.

Still, the boot times (yes I know, not a proper boot up so to speak) are much lower than before, the sleep time is also much lower, which is nice too.
Woodspoon 28th April 2013, 18:01 Quote
AAAAAnd cue endless bickering between those that say it's great and those that say it aint.
Personally I really dislike it, feels very conflicted and it's given me a huge shove towards running Linux on my main rig full time if this is the future.
DragunovHUN 28th April 2013, 18:14 Quote
Quote:
power button[...]

Having ironed out the more pressing issues

I see what you did there.
theshadow2001 28th April 2013, 18:16 Quote
I have found that using start8, removing the left side hot corners and defaulting items to open with their desktop program has pretty much nullified any metro related issues I have with Windows 8. After those minor changes I'm left with an overall improved version of windows 7. I never see metro unless I choose to.
Sensei 28th April 2013, 18:26 Quote
I've played around with Windows 8 and enjoyed using it but there is very little Windows 8 offers to justify spending any money upgrading from the fantastic Windows 7.
sheninat0r 28th April 2013, 18:47 Quote
Just so you know, you're not forced to sign in with a Microsoft account. You can create a local account instead; of course, the local account button was probably in 6pt font on the bottom left corner of the initial login page.

Also, Win+C and Win+X.
Yslen 28th April 2013, 18:47 Quote
The Skype issue is because the desktop version is not intended for Windows 8, though it still works if you want it. The Windows 8 version is the metro/modern version. The two won't talk to each other because they're different releases and it's not intended that you install both. It's using third party software that's caused your problem here.

The 'modern' apps are pretty much universally worse than desktop equivalents. We shouldn't be surprised by this as they're intended for poking with your fingers on a tablet. If you've got 8 on a desktop, use the desktop, it's better. The exception is things like Skype, Twitter etc which work pretty well snapped to one side of the screen. It would be good to get a few more options on the start screen for controlling software, such as uninstalling directly rather than taking you to the add/remove section of the control panel for non-modern apps.

There's no full shutdown in Windows 8, it's always hibernating to some degree, that's why it's so quick to boot. Regardless, hit ALT+F4 to get the shutdown dialogue, just as in every other version of Windows I can remember. To be honest though, CTRL+I and clicking twice is no more difficult than the windows key then clicking twice as it's been since XP. it's just that it's something new to remember. I'd like to see a clock and basic account control inc. shutdown and restart find their way onto the start screen, there's a lot of wasted space there at the moment, and it would be an easy way to appease some of the critics who seem to be lost without the start menu.

There's a typo in the last line of paragraph 15. There's no "Star Menu" in any version of Windows :P

Personally if you're on a desktop, just avoid the majority of the 'modern' apps, use the desktop most of the time and treat the Start Screen as a full-screen start menu (with better search capability). Learn a few shortcuts and it's actually faster to navigate around.

Not to mention that it's a faster OS anyway. Boot times and performance on lower powered hardware are both hugely improved over 7. My E-450 laptop is much better under 8 than any other OS I've had on it. MS just needs to tweak a few things here and there and I'll be happy.
Yslen 28th April 2013, 18:49 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheninat0r
Just so you know, you're not forced to sign in with a Microsoft account. You can create a local account instead; of course, the local account button was probably in 6pt font on the bottom left corner of the initial login page.

Also, Win+C and Win+X.

It's not that hard to spot, it's even underlined IIRC. It's not like it's an extra step either, it's just done later on in the process. You used to have to create an account during the install.

Don't forget Win+I !!
r3loaded 28th April 2013, 19:05 Quote
My experience after a few months of using Windows 8 on my desktop:
  • I'm largely using the start screen as an improved start menu - I've pinned my regular apps there, with *very* frequently used apps pinned to my taskbar as well. Searching is stupidly easy.
  • There's still a dearth of apps (at least for me), even if you're using it on a tablet. That said I like using Nextgen Reader and Reddhub for when I just want to sit back and browse.
  • The Mail app has been improved a lot but is still kinda sucky. I've switched over to Mailbird now - it's a .NET desktop app but has a very nice Metro aesthetic (and it's far more functional).
  • Following on from the above, there seems to be a general lack of Metro apps that are as functional as their desktop counterparts. I think this has more to do with unimaginative or uninterested developers than anything to do with the platform, which is a shame really. A lot of the best devs seem to live exclusively in Apple-land for some reason :(
  • It's significantly faster than Windows 7, especially on my dad's Thinkpad. If nothing else, the performance improvement alone is worth upgrading (and Start8 exists if you find Metro completely offensive and you swear you won't adapt in a million years).
  • Having integrated antivirus is awesome. I don't even need to *think* about it, it's ready to go as soon as Windows is installed.
  • I just hit the computer's power button to shutdown. Is it really that hard?

That all said, literally the only thing that's stopping me switching over completely to Linux or OS X is PC games. Otherwise all of my stuff can be accomplished perfectly well in a platform-neutral manner.
Phil Rhodes 28th April 2013, 19:07 Quote
I'll ask the same question I asked about 7: what new features does it have?

The answer for 7 was "effectively none", overlooking a few extremely trivial things that could have been added to XP with a service pack.

Worse, with 8, the new feature seems to be a UI that more or less everyone agrees is hideous; introductory articles almost all mention ways to get around it. I'm used to every new version of windows adding gradually more and more crap you have to turn off on install, but this is a pretty extreme example.

At some point it's necessary to accept that, much as we don't clamour for the latest feature update on, say, books, there may not be much of a need to keep tweaking operating systems. Sorry, MS, you're going to have to figure out how to make a living without selling us a bunch of futile new polishing every couple of years.
k4p84 28th April 2013, 19:13 Quote
I dont really use Modern UI, hit Win+D upon booting. I do find that some search results ie win + 'search query' don't work the same as Win7, I can't find folder options for example atm which used to be win + folder. I think we are stuck in the stage where desktops are not always touch enabled, laptops are heading that way and tablets have it already. It is a hybrid input situation with touch, mouse and keyboard that will likely work well for Win8 just it is a bit ahead of the hardware.
Stanley Tweedle 28th April 2013, 19:15 Quote
I bought windows ate when it was £24.99. I thought my windows 7 was screwed and I no longer have access to the win 7 key. Turns out my 7 is fine but I can't reinstall cos I no longer have the key (don't ask). Surprised to find win 8 easy to use and I have no major trouble moving between new UI and old. The only really bad thing I've found on 8 so far is the win 8 skype. It's the worst version of skype I've ever used.

I think the biggest problem with 8 is not the new UI but microsoft's pricing policy. Apple's O.S. retails for £13. Windows 8 pro costs £198. At that price they actually deserve to be pirated.
carajp 28th April 2013, 19:41 Quote
I used StartIsBack. Same principle, only £2. :)
Since then I haven't looked back. I came to see that Win 8 is an evolutionary step up from Win 7, and actually I like the (small) changes and improvements. So I won't be going back to 7. But 8 is not a huge enough improvement over 7 to justify a high price (I got it while it was around £25).
I feel very sorry for poor Windows 8. It's a perfectly good O/S that has been hobbled by having a hideous and inconvenient interface slapped over the top of it.
Asouter 28th April 2013, 20:33 Quote
Damn I was hoping for a definitive answer on if I should get Windows 8, but like the mental image of Antony "F"ing and blinding at his lap top. I already swear far too much so I'll wait just that lil bit longer me thinks
Nexxo 28th April 2013, 20:41 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by r3loaded
[*]Following on from the above, there seems to be a general lack of Metro apps that are as functional as their desktop counterparts. I think this has more to do with unimaginative or uninterested developers than anything to do with the platform, which is a shame really. A lot of the best devs seem to live exclusively in Apple-land for some reason :(

Totally agree. DeviantArt and several other sites show possible Metro design concepts of popular apps like Facebook, Twitter etc. and they are all simply beautiful, so it's baffling how developers knock out pale, crappy apps.

Microsoft doesn't help either by simply not polishing their apps very much. They could be much better with little effort. Live Tiles are not fully exploited. The App store is a graphic nightmare. I mean, who the hell came up with that design?!?

Of course when a good app comes along, such as the BBC News app by Gripper, it is sabotaged by the BBC which nonetheless cannot be asked to develop one of its own.

Notch meanwhile will happily launch Minecraft on every closed platform going, except Windows 8, because he thinks it is... too closed. It isn't of course; it's as open as Windows 7, but even game programmers can be hypocritical pretentious assholes, I guess.
VaLkyR-Assassin 28th April 2013, 20:43 Quote
I hated it, and a neighbour sent a laptop back because she didn't like it either.
impar 28th April 2013, 21:21 Quote
Greetings!
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Article
However, one simple option that at least allows you to use the Desktop as you used to - along with booting into it and also retaining a customisable Start Button - is Start8. In short, it's probably the best $5 I've ever spent.
;)

You could also try Modern Mix, for when you feel the need to run a Metro app in Windows:
http://www.stardock.com/products/modernmix/
modfx 28th April 2013, 21:39 Quote
My girlfriend got a win8 laptop, had a play, raged. It just makes no sense to me.
modd1uk 28th April 2013, 22:27 Quote
" Windows 8 demanded that I jump through numerous hoops first, including entering my Hotmail account username and password, before it let me log on "

Or just click local account. No offense but that article is retarded.
will_123 28th April 2013, 22:35 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by modd1uk
" Windows 8 demanded that I jump through numerous hoops first, including entering my Hotmail account username and password, before it let me log on "

Or just click local account. No offense but that article is retarded.

Not really, its the fact that it pushes you into creating an account before you even hit the "desktop" or whatever they call metro. Local accounts should be standard followed by the choice of linked it to a live account.
modd1uk 28th April 2013, 22:40 Quote
Pushes you into creating a user account ? You mean like previous versions of windows where you have to put a username...just because its called a " local account " doesn't mean its any different from previous versions of windows.

The Live account is just an extra, don't like it then don't use it, just use a local account like we have done for years.
loftie 28th April 2013, 22:54 Quote
Quote:
Something I loved about Windows 7 was the enhanced search. I was initially stumped in Windows 8 but eventually found that instead of clicking in a search box, simply typing in Metro starts the search automatically. This is all well and good, but I still prefer clicking on icons, especially those pinned to the taskbar, to open regularly-used programs - okay maybe that's just a personal preference thing.

Confused by this. What does clicking on icons pinned to the taskbar have to do with Search?

Options available to you -

Pin programs to Start Screen
Pin programs to taskbar, you can still do this
Click on icon when you start to search for something as the results appear
will_123 28th April 2013, 22:57 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by modd1uk
Pushes you into creating a user account ? You mean like previous versions of windows where you have to put a username...just because its called a " local account " doesn't mean its any different from previous versions of windows.

The Live account is just an extra, don't like it then don't use it, just use a local account like we have done for years.

No it pushed you towards creating a live account if you don't have one. Local account creation is second to that. Its nothing like they have done for years.
modd1uk 28th April 2013, 22:59 Quote
I wasn't forced to do anything, its not rocket science. I think the article is retarded, its an opinion of mine, opinions are like arseholes...everybody has one.
loftie 28th April 2013, 23:01 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by will_123
No it pushed you towards creating a live account if you don't have one. Local account creation is second to that. Its nothing like they have done for years.

I don't think it really "pushed you" to create one, but it does encourage you to. The local account option is still there. I started off with a local account and then changed to a live account.
will_123 28th April 2013, 23:04 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by loftie
I don't think it really "pushed you" to create one, but it does encourage you to. The local account option is still there. I started off with a local account and then changed to a live account.

No maybe pushed is a strong word for it. But yes it encourages it, and to say its the same they have done for years is nonsense.
modd1uk 28th April 2013, 23:05 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by will_123
No maybe pushed is a strong word for it. But yes it encourages it, and to say its the same they have done for years is nonsense.

I said creating a local account is the same we have done for years.
supermonkey 28th April 2013, 23:07 Quote
Once again, I find myself reading an article from a professional tech journalist. And once again, I find myself a bit puzzled as to why the reviewer is recommending a start button replacement almost right off the bat.

I think I'm just going to have to resign myself to never understanding what is do difficult about the new start screen. It's functionally the exact same thing. People keep complaining about having to click in the lower left corner so that they can access a program icon. So they download a third party program that allows them to click in the lower left corner so that they can click icons. The new start screen is just a graphical representation of the start menu, and in my opinion it looks cleaner and is easier to organize.

I guess at this point we could just add a link to the lengthy (and circular) discussion that has already addressed most of these points already. And for what it's worth, I use a local account as well.
Nexxo 28th April 2013, 23:07 Quote
Quote:
As usual with new laptops, the OS is pre-installed so all you have to do is type in the usual blurb such as account name and WiFi password and away you go. Except it wasn’t quite that simple with Windows 8. With Windows 7, you can skip various steps such as Windows update settings and the like and just get to the desktop – useful if you know what you’re doing.

Windows 8 demanded that I jump through numerous hoops first, including entering my Hotmail account username and password, before it let me log on. Then, having set my preferred background colour, it decided to cycle through the full spectrum of other colours whilst completing the install. Pretty, but wholly unnecessary.
So in Windows 7 you have to enter a username and passwords. In Windows 8 you have to enter a user name and passwords. Oh, the humanity!

And then it puts you though the onerous task of picking a colour. And then it has the temerity of showing some eye candy while it is busy installing. Outrageous!
Quote:
Using the Mail application from Metro was also a pain in the rear. It seemed overly-simplified to me, and it was a nightmare opening attachments. While I was out, I needed to view an attachment and then get back to the email while on a call with a courier company. It took far longer to fiddle around in Metro than it would have done on the desktop, with the main issue being it wasn’t obvious where files, attachments and such like were being opened and how to get at them.
And this is different from Windows 7 how?
Quote:
Then there’s the issue of shutting down or restarting. It’s probably the simplest but most utterly ridiculous issue in Windows 8. I prefer shutting my PC down because it means I can turn off hibernation and save a shedload of disk space on my SSD. Other people do it to save money on their electricity bills, so to add several layers of menus and the condescending-sounding Charm Bar to get at the power options was a serious no no. On a tablet you have the option of hitting the power button to be given an instant option to power down, but not so here.

Microsoft seems to have forgotten that for PC users, the PC power button is usually located under a desk, or two feet above it meaning it’s far more convenient to use the Start Button.
God forbid that you'd have to reach up or bend down to hit a power button! And you know: you don't have to call it a Charms bar. If you want to regard yourself like a grown up power user who is not to be trifled with, you can call it the "Mystic Runes of Summoning bar" or something.

Sorry, but this article is indeed BS and far below the standard of Bit-Tech. I have read Windows 8 reviews by Apple users that are more balanced and informed.
ArcAngeL 28th April 2013, 23:10 Quote
Have a play with the restore features, it cleans out the system without deleting your files.only apps that require reinstalling. And they are listed in a html document placed on your desktop.

windows 8 is a tablet OS first, and desktop OS second, it was created to be simple to cater to the simple minded, 8.1 should fix many grievances, that desktop users have, but so does start 8. The tile apps in desktop mode is a huge importance for desktop users. I like to call them t-apps cause they are touch enabled apps, but also cause they are tile based apps.

8.1 is also supposed to bring some improved back up.
loftie 28th April 2013, 23:13 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by will_123
No maybe pushed is a strong word for it. But yes it encourages it, and to say its the same they have done for years is nonsense.

It's the same in the sense that an account must be made. That much holds true. The difference now is that 2 styles of account can be created - live or local. I don't know what the procedure is like to create a live account on login- as I had one - but it can't be too different from,

enter username
enter password
enter password again
secret question

I'd imagine that MS wants the Live account to be default simply so that Average Brenda can have her emails, messaging, calendar, contacts all neatly set up.
will_123 28th April 2013, 23:19 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by loftie
It's the same in the sense that an account must be made. That much holds true. The difference now is that 2 styles of account can be created - live or local. I don't know what the procedure is like to create a live account on login- as I had one - but it can't be too different from,

enter username
enter password
enter password again
secret question

I'd imagine that MS wants the Live account to be default simply so that Average Brenda can have her emails, messaging, calendar, contacts all neatly set up.

Yes 2 styles are available i just felt it was another attempt to get me to sign up for a email address i didn't want or need. I don't really have any problems with the OS. It lightening to boot, i just have to deal with metro for 4 seconds when i boot and switch over to the desktop.
loftie 28th April 2013, 23:26 Quote
Yea I get that, lets face it if W8 gets MS more users to use their services then I'm sure they won't complain.
will_123 28th April 2013, 23:28 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by loftie
Yea I get that, lets face it if W8 gets MS more users to use their services then I'm sure they won't complain.

Ha they most certainly wont! I reckon that's what its their for. Tie more people in.
modd1uk 28th April 2013, 23:30 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by will_123
Yes 2 styles are available i just felt it was another attempt to get me to sign up for a email address i didn't want or need. I don't really have any problems with the OS. It lightening to boot, i just have to deal with metro for 4 seconds when i boot and switch over to the desktop.

If you dont use metro at all then just use a start menu, it will bypass metro for you.
Shirty 28th April 2013, 23:36 Quote
More hardware reviews please lads ;)
Nexxo 28th April 2013, 23:36 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by will_123
Yes 2 styles are available i just felt it was another attempt to get me to sign up for a email address i didn't want or need.

That's nonsense. If you want to sync your files and settings across devices then of course you need cloud access and of course that would per default be a Microsoft service. But it does not push that onto you any more than iOS or iTunes pushes an Apple account on you.
FullThrottleRic 28th April 2013, 23:38 Quote
Articles like this frustrate me, I really don't understand the hatred of the start screen and knee jerk "ZOMG I want a start button!" reactions people have. Windows 7 - click the bottom left, then click on the program you want. Windows 8 - click the bottom left, then click on the program you want. The list of programs looks a bit different, but it's exactly the same process, only now when you're looking at your list of programs the ones that support it give you some extra info without having to fire them up.
I do agree with the shut down procedure seeming like a bit of a faff, but it's only one more click than it was in 7... Lastly I do think 8 works much better with a mouse than a laptop trackpad. I find there's a lot of long sweeping motions to be done which are easy with a mouse but can require a few stabs at it on a laptop.
faugusztin 28th April 2013, 23:44 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by will_123
Yes 2 styles are available i just felt it was another attempt to get me to sign up for a email address i didn't want or need.

What does Microsoft account has with "signing up for a email address" ? My Microsoft account is tied to an email address on my own domain, hosted at Google as a part of the free Google Apps account. You can use any email address for Microsoft account, all MS account is your email address & password for authentication, and then server side information tied to that account so it can provide you various services (XBOX, GFWL, Windows 8 sync stuff, Windows Phone stuff etc etc).
theshadow2001 28th April 2013, 23:56 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by supermonkey
Once again, I find myself reading an article from a professional tech journalist. And once again, I find myself a bit puzzled as to why the reviewer is recommending a start button replacement almost right off the bat.

I think I'm just going to have to resign myself to never understanding what is do difficult about the new start screen. It's functionally the exact same thing. People keep complaining about having to click in the lower left corner so that they can access a program icon. So they download a third party program that allows them to click in the lower left corner so that they can click icons. The new start screen is just a graphical representation of the start menu, and in my opinion it looks cleaner and is easier to organize.

I guess at this point we could just add a link to the lengthy (and circular) discussion that has already addressed most of these points already. And for what it's worth, I use a local account as well.

The start screen is very inconsistent thematically with the desktop interface. The transition between environments is harsh. It requires manual organisation and will continue to do so as you install programs. It doesn't provide access to a shutdown/sleep. It won't tell you your commonly used programs. In fact it provides less overall functionality and poorer search functionality than the windows 7 menu. It does have live tiles which gets a giant "meh" from me in terms of usefulness. The hot corner pop-up is quite annoying. There's no nifty menu with origin and steam which gives me a list of recently played games. There's more to UI design than how many clicks it takes to do something.
Nexxo 29th April 2013, 00:07 Quote
I disagree. The Start Menu needed continuous manual organisation and I found the endless cascading menus with tiny icons hard to search visually (not to mention that if you lost focus halfway by a tiny move of the mouse, the cascade collapsed and you had to start all over again). I used RocketDock as a replacement, it was that dismal. I think that the Start Screen is far superior.
theshadow2001 29th April 2013, 00:09 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nexxo

God forbid that you'd have to reach up or bend down to hit a power button!

Welcome to 1995 ;)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nexxo
I disagree. The Start Menu needed continuous manual organisation and I found the endless cascading menus with tiny icons hard to search visually (not to mention that if you lost focus halfway by a tiny move of the mouse, the cascade collapsed and you had to start all over again). I used RocketDock as a replacement, it was that dismal. I think that the Start Screen is far superior.

What on earth were you doing that required constant reorganising. Was an alphabetical list of installed programs not organised enough? :|
supermonkey 29th April 2013, 00:17 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by theshadow2001
There's more to UI design than how many clicks it takes to do something.
I agree wholeheartedly, and it's why I added my opinion that the list of programs looks cleaner and is easier to organize. Much of what you mention has been discussed ad nauseum in the other thread. But since you mention it, a lot of people have been objecting to the new UI because it might add 1 or 2 clicks to (insert given task), e.g. shutting down.

The new start screen only really requires manual organization if you want it set up a particular way. The old start menu also required manual organization if you wanted all your programs grouped a particular way. Windows 8 is no different in that regard. Furthermore, the old start menu was a cascading list of directories that collapsed if your mouse lost focus. This is one reason I think the new start screen is cleaner. In the other thread, it was pointed out that the 'commonly used programs' list was inconsistent, and could change things around with no warning to the user. We'll have to agree to disagree about whether the 'commonly used programs' list offered much benefit - I never used it. Other members have also pointed out that you can pin your favorite Steam games to the start screen. In my opinion that's not really any different than the menu displaying your list of commonly played games (which may change without your input).

Please explain how the new start menu offers poorer search functionality and less overall functionality. I'm not sure I understand how 'just start typing' is poorer search functionality.
CrapBag 29th April 2013, 00:31 Quote
I used win 8 briefly and the fact that I couldn't even have a decent video driver put me off, although that was more to do with the manufacturer of the laptop than anything else.

Win 8 is so divisional, some like it and some don't (personally I'm not keen).

Win 7 was universally accepted because it wasn't too different from windows of old but better in every way where as win 8 changed things a little too much and it shows in the sales figures.

People seem very defensive of win 8 but I don't see the reason to upgrade from 7 to be honest, serioulsy what will I gain?
Guinevere 29th April 2013, 00:54 Quote
The thing I find most confusing about this article is why it has a date of 28th April when surely it is describing a tech journalists first experience with Windows 8...

So wasn't this written back in the Autumn?
CrapBag 29th April 2013, 01:15 Quote
I believe he has only recently purchased a laptop that had win 8 pre installed so this is his first experience of the OS.
theshadow2001 29th April 2013, 01:38 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by supermonkey
I agree wholeheartedly, and it's why I added my opinion that the list of programs looks cleaner and is easier to organize. Much of what you mention has been discussed ad nauseum in the other thread. But since you mention it, a lot of people have been objecting to the new UI because it might add 1 or 2 clicks to (insert given task), e.g. shutting down.

The new start screen only really requires manual organization if you want it set up a particular way. The old start menu also required manual organization if you wanted all your programs grouped a particular way. Windows 8 is no different in that regard. Furthermore, the old start menu was a cascading list of directories that collapsed if your mouse lost focus. This is one reason I think the new start screen is cleaner. In the other thread, it was pointed out that the 'commonly used programs' list was inconsistent, and could change things around with no warning to the user. We'll have to agree to disagree about whether the 'commonly used programs' list offered much benefit - I never used it. Other members have also pointed out that you can pin your favorite Steam games to the start screen. In my opinion that's not really any different than the menu displaying your list of commonly played games (which may change without your input).

Please explain how the new start menu offers poorer search functionality and less overall functionality. I'm not sure I understand how 'just start typing' is poorer search functionality.

On the whole clicks thing. Its not about the number of clicks, its about how much you use your mouse. So 4 clicks in a small area could be better than two clicks in opposite corners.

I'm not sure that it looks cleaner, perhaps if all icons could be metrofied.There's a huge disparity between metro icons and regular desktop icons. Also if you do use the view all apps any cleanness goes right out the window. I find persistent menus quite annoying. The calender in ubuntu was one such thing. I would click on it, it would open I would check the date, done, then click away to move focus and it was still there :(. I find pinning things to constant UI elements really clutters up the place. Sort of like putting postits everywhere. Where as the menu associated with the steam or origin icon has everything tucked neatly away waiting to be accessed. Adobe pdf reader has a bunch of my last read pdfs as well. I don't want all of those pinned to my taskbar or as desktop shortcuts. Also the the recently played menu again is self maintaining. Pinned icons and shortcuts are not.

Basically, no self organistion, no recent lists from applications (is there even recent functionality at all), no shutdown functionality, poorer search. There's probably more but I'm not going to be exhaustive at this time of night. The search functionality annoyingly only searches apps, you then have to manually change category if you want search for a document or other non app item. Its a step backwards.
supermonkey 29th April 2013, 02:31 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by theshadow2001
The search functionality annoyingly only searches apps, you then have to manually change category if you want search for a document or other non app item. Its a step backwards.
I see that as a good thing. Rather than having search return everything with a given name it segregates the search results so that I can choose to view the results that are limited to programs, settings, or files, rather than lumping them all together.
theshadow2001 29th April 2013, 02:47 Quote
Sub-categorisation is generally a good thing but its implemented badly in this instance. If it was done to first return all results the windows 7 menu would for the same search and then let the user choose a category if necessary (usually it wouldn't be). I would see that as an improvement over what was in windows 7. The current start screen search set up requires more interaction than is necessary.

I think this will be fixed in Windows Blue though
Edwards 29th April 2013, 09:29 Quote
Saw winzip, laughed to myself and knew not to take the article too seriously.

You're several months behind the 'we hate windows 8' bandwagon, telling us information about windows 8 that we already know, and making the same (invalid) complaints that many, many other articles have done.

Windows 8 isn't perfect, that's obvious. It is also clearly designed with touch interface in mind, that is clear. That doesn't mean that it isn't a viable desktop OS and I actually prefer it to windows 7. The start menu/screen is really a non-issue once you go to the effort of playing around with it. Searching is exactly the same, win key + search string, however it is grouped better and you get a full screen of results, rather than needing to focus on the bottom left corner of the screen.

The only complaint I really have with windows 8 is the integration of metro apps on a dual screen. One screen is considered your main screen, and this is the one that the start screen appears on. This is also the only screen you can have metro apps running on, without moving your main screen to another screen. This is frustrating as I'd quite like to have half of my second screen using an app (skype, music or w/e), and have my main screen for whatever I'm actively doing at the time.
Nexxo 29th April 2013, 09:34 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edwards
Saw winzip, laughed to myself and knew not to take the article too seriously.

Very true; that should have been a cue. :p
impar 29th April 2013, 10:25 Quote
Greetings!
Quote:
Originally Posted by theshadow2001
The search functionality annoyingly only searches apps, you then have to manually change category if you want search for a document or other non app item. Its a step backwards.
That is expected to be fixed in 8.1, providing a global search. It also seems to have a "most used" list.
DbD 29th April 2013, 10:29 Quote
UI wise it's just a mess. It's 2 different ui's badly bolted together, the primary one of which is designed for a tablet, not a keyboard/mouse that it's actually being used with.

They basically developed it for the surface pro - so they sacrificed the 500 million or whatever keyboard/mouse users experience for the 5 or less million surface pro users. It doesn't even work well for a tablet because half the programmes need the desktop interface which is rubbish for a touch screen.

In that way it's the worst windows ui MS have ever managed to produce - in the past while flawed at least it was schizophrenic.
DbD 29th April 2013, 10:30 Quote
*was not* schizophrenic. Please add an edit button (even if it only allows editing for 1 hour or something).
Tynecider 29th April 2013, 10:33 Quote
I have no more rage left for Windows 8, Sorry.
Edwards 29th April 2013, 10:37 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by DbD
*was not* schizophrenic. Please add an edit button (even if it only allows editing for 1 hour or something).

If you go to your post in the forum thread for these comments (ie http://forums.bit-tech.net/showpost.php?p=3337312&postcount=54) you can edit it there.
impar 29th April 2013, 10:48 Quote
Greetings!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tynecider
I have no more rage left for Windows 8, Sorry.
Satisfied with it?
Or just dont care?
Mikee 29th April 2013, 11:06 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by DbD
UI wise it's just a mess. It's 2 different ui's badly bolted together, the primary one of which is designed for a tablet, not a keyboard/mouse that it's actually being used with.

They basically developed it for the surface pro - so they sacrificed the 500 million or whatever keyboard/mouse users experience for the 5 or less million surface pro users. It doesn't even work well for a tablet because half the programmes need the desktop interface which is rubbish for a touch screen.

In that way it's the worst windows ui MS have ever managed to produce - in the past while flawed at least it was schizophrenic.

Can someone explain to me how Windows 8 doesn't work when using keyboard and mouse? It's one of the most common complaints I've seen but no examples of why it is a problem.

I have been using Windows 8 on my main PC since the consumer preview and not had any problems with it. I use the desktop as I did with Windows 7 with shortcuts and pinned folders to access common programs and files and for others I simply have to press the Win key and start typing the name of what I'm after, it's hardly rocket science...
littlepuppi 29th April 2013, 11:06 Quote
The weird thing for me is , as an IT addict and working in IT, I'm normally all over these releases, often beta testing the OS... Windows 8, I forget its even released. Im so happy with 7 I just would not move, unless it was literally amazing.... There is nothing that would make me want to even install it to be frank, and that is the problem.. Windows 7 does everything I need it to do. Until it stops doing what I need from it, Im not going to budge. This is the first OS where i have felt quite so committed... Its the old push pull analogy and the pull for windows 8 is barely registering and the push does not exist...
theshadow2001 29th April 2013, 11:10 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edwards

You're several months behind the 'we hate windows 8' bandwagon, telling us information about windows 8 that we already know, and making the same (invalid) complaints that many, many other articles have done.

In fairness, this isn't a windows 8 review. Its a blog about his first experiences and thoughts of 8.
Hustler 29th April 2013, 11:10 Quote
W8 is not going near my PC, tried it for 2 days on a virtual machine, loathed it, you have to jump through too many hoops to do even the most mundane of things.

If I bought a new desktop,laptop today, the first thing I'd do is format that POS off the Hdrive and install W7.

W7 will be supported for the next 4-5 yrs, and I'm hoping by the time it's ended, Linux will be a genuine alternative with proper gaming support.
DbD 29th April 2013, 12:05 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edwards
Quote:
Originally Posted by DbD
*was not* schizophrenic. Please add an edit button (even if it only allows editing for 1 hour or something).

If you go to your post in the forum thread for these comments (ie http://forums.bit-tech.net/showpost.php?p=3337312&postcount=54) you can edit it there.

Ah, ok, didn't know that.

Thanks.
Silver51 29th April 2013, 12:13 Quote
Eeh, bought a new laptop. It came with Windows 8, tried to like it, failed, now running Windows 7.
rollo 29th April 2013, 12:41 Quote
Nexxo is pro windows 8 as much as i am pro nvidia so to see him defending it is expected.

I have ran it since launch but have reverted back to windows 7 in recent weeks i did not use the metro ui and was gaining little been on windows 8. Start8 is great but should not be required.

The fact that they have since said they are bringing it back is kinda funny and is admitting they have made a mistake.

Price is also gone through the roof for a copy of windows 8 pro, No one will spend the sort of money they are asking for it unless they have to have it. ( judging by the sales no one does)

Even at the £25 they were asking for on launch it struggled to pick up sales now its alot more than that which just seems kinda nuts.

Windows 7 is supported to 2020 for the record. By which stage there will be another windows version ( another 7 more versions if they release 1 a year as expected) out which is likely going to get its start menu back among other things. ( maybe even allowing us to select the desktop as the default setting without start 8 installed)
impar 29th April 2013, 12:44 Quote
Greetings!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver51
Eeh, bought a new laptop. It came with Windows 8, tried to like it, failed, now running Windows 7.
Could have tried any of the StartMenu alternatives and\or Metro killers.
Windows 8 isnt really bad as a OS, it just has a messy UI.
Ivoryspike 29th April 2013, 13:09 Quote
Wow, what a terrible article (blog, whatever). Why is this even here...
loftie 29th April 2013, 13:17 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikee
Can someone explain to me how Windows 8 doesn't work when using keyboard and mouse? It's one of the most common complaints I've seen but no examples of why it is a problem.

+1
I don't understand the issue either.
Xir 29th April 2013, 14:42 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivoryspike
Wow, what a terrible article (blog, whatever). Why is this even here...

If anything, it shows that this long after launch not much has changed (yet).
Actually, shutting off the gestures from the touchpad is probably the smartest part I've read here, because they seem to be quite annoying for the inexperienced user (and maybe for the experienced as well)

For 25, I'd have tried Win8.
As it is, I've got a Win7 key lying around for nothing, I'm not spending the money for Win8 my new rig.
loftie 29th April 2013, 17:34 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xir
If anything, it shows that this long after launch not much has changed (yet).
Actually, shutting off the gestures from the touchpad is probably the smartest part I've read here, because they seem to be quite annoying for the inexperienced user (and maybe for the experienced as well)

I've not used W8 on a laptop, however going by Goodbytes' post in the Windows 8 Marmite thread, it seemed to me like the gestures were not on by default. If this is the case, imo this lays the blame with the manufacturers not with MS.

Anyone who's installed W8 on a laptop themselves confirm this?
Yslen 29th April 2013, 20:01 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by loftie
I've not used W8 on a laptop, however going by Goodbytes' post in the Windows 8 Marmite thread, it seemed to me like the gestures were not on by default. If this is the case, imo this lays the blame with the manufacturers not with MS.

Anyone who's installed W8 on a laptop themselves confirm this?

Gestures are off on my laptop, which I installed W8 on myself.
Yslen 29th April 2013, 20:07 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by loftie
+1
I don't understand the issue either.

Same.

Windows 8 has all the same controls as Windows 7. Just ignore the touch-centric stuff, that's for tablets and all-in-ones with touch. Use they keyboard.
mikemaher205 29th April 2013, 22:01 Quote
I haven't read all the comments, but already getting some helpful hints about how to shut down my PC fully and I've since created a local account, so thank you all you more advanced users out there.

In my personal opinion, I think that Windows 8 is under more threat than it realises. I have Office 2013 Pro, but it does not support the modern UI in any way which seems stupid as MS have put so much effort into making it linked with SkyDrive (which is a very handy free service). So much emphasis on cloud storage but no real Windows 8 support.

Another area I feel MS will suffer from is Linux, more specifically, Ubuntu. Now that Steam has officially started supporting it, more and more enthusiasts, gamers and tech-savy people will move across as it does everything you need, nothing you don't, while demanding a low power system (cheap to build) and the OS is free (cheaper still).

I am waiting for major games to go across to Linux before making the full jump...
dullonien 29th April 2013, 23:39 Quote
My experiences over the past year and half using Windows 8:

1. People might think logging in using a Live account is silly, but you'll be glad if/when you come to re-installing Windows because a Live account backs-up your preferences and automatically restores them. I'm not entirely sure how much it saves, but it certainly restores themes, colours, wallpapers etc. I'm not sure about modern apps, or start screen layout etc. but I'm sure it's something MS will be looking to expand like they have in WP8 which backs-up and restores everything.

2. Personally I think people may be too quick to install or recommend programs like Start8. Is not having a start button important in any way to those of us who are capable of understanding that there are hot corners? Is booting to the desktop a must-have feature? I ask the same question to people who criticise W8 for booting to the start screen, and that is 'what is the benefit of having it start to the desktop?'. You still have to run a program, so why not do that from the start screen (clicking on a tile to run desktop chrome for example), but first quickly check whether or not you have new e-mails etc?

3. I agree with the poor quality of modern apps. I have no issues personally with the mail app, it does all I need which is to manage my 4 e-mail accounts (personal, junk, university, and professional), giving the ability to read, compose and delete messages quickly. I don't quite understand the author's issues with attachments. They appear at the top of e-mails, and you click once to download and again to open where they will open into the program you choose (pdf's open in acrobat for me). About as straightforward as it comes, no?

But many other apps are quite poor. I still hate the music app for example. I don't use many others though. The calendar app is fine for what I need, as is the WP8 app (to transfer data) after a rocky start.

4. The shut-down button is a little annoying. But I really do find that using the the physical power button is the most sensible way to shut-down a pc. Everyone should have their power button's reasonably accessible, otherwise how do they turn them on to begin with? Hitting it and walking off is as simple as it comes.

5. There are a lot of improvements to Windows 8 other than Modern UI. So those saying what's the point of upgrading, I'd say there's a lot of reasons, especially for us power users. Built-in multi-monitor support is nice, as is built in anti-virus. Then there's the speed improvements, both in general use and in boot-up times. There are many, many more, so I won't go into them all now.

6. So in my opinion W8 is an improvement on W7. It offers everything W7 does + improvements to the desktop experience + a good touch screen interface to boot (not that I currently use that aspect). There are things that need improving, namely the quality of the modern apps, and the transition between the modern UI and desktop, but this doesn't stop me from doing my work and taking advantage of those benefits.
loftie 30th April 2013, 00:03 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by dullonien
3. I agree with the poor quality of modern apps. I have no issues personally with the mail app, it does all I need which is to manage my 4 e-mail accounts (personal, junk, university, and professional), giving the ability to read, compose and delete messages quickly. I don't quite understand the author's issues with attachments.

I've had issues with attachments not opening in the default program for some reason. Had to save file then open. Can't remember what it was though. Other than that though, I'm happy with Mail, it does everything I need.
Ivoryspike 30th April 2013, 00:57 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by dullonien
My experiences over the past year and half using Windows 8:

1. People might think logging in using a Live account is silly, but you'll be glad if/when you come to re-installing Windows because a Live account backs-up your preferences and automatically restores them.....

+1
Doctor Hades 30th April 2013, 11:43 Quote
I've been using Windows 8 Pro since last October but I honestly only bought it to take advantage of the fact it was cheap (£40). I did not try the beta because of the negative comments so, Initially, I found myself hating it, primarily because of the new Start screen interface which I found to be incredibly jarring when used alongside the desktop. The apps were basic to the point of being useless and swiping the mouse down to close apps when I close them by clicking on the X in the corner of the window on the desktop just added to the horribly inconsistent feel.

I was about to revert back to my Windows 7 Home Premium backup when I discovered Start8, which added back the Start menu and most of the functionality which is hidden in the Start screen 'clutter'. Since then I haven't looked back but that's honestly because apart from the odd Windows Store game (which are depressingly overpriced compared to their iOS and Android counterparts) I don't use the Start screen at all.

As such I'm left with a faster loading and marginally slicker running version of Windows 7 and I don't miss Aero Glass at all, especially as I now no longer see those annoying "Windows is running slow" messages after exiting demanding games.

Windows 8 is, on reflection, a bit of a mess. I really think that Microsoft should have kept their tablet/smartphone operating system separate from their desktop/laptop one. Even Apple have iOS and OSX for that reason. It was a massive mistake to force a tablet interface on desktop users IMO; the Start screen should always have been *optional*.
loftie 30th April 2013, 18:21 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doctor Hades
Windows 8 is, on reflection, a bit of a mess. I really think that Microsoft should have kept their tablet/smartphone operating system separate from their desktop/laptop one. Even Apple have iOS and OSX for that reason. It was a massive mistake to force a tablet interface on desktop users IMO; the Start screen should always have been *optional*.

I remember talking to MS reps coming up to and on release of W7. They were pushing that as a touch.

I'm curious as to what exactly you mean by the tablet interface, are you referring to the Start Screen?
leexgx 30th April 2013, 20:06 Quote
yes
loftie 30th April 2013, 20:31 Quote
But with that in mind is the desktop not a tablet interface? Icons basically the same size as a tile, arranged in rows and columns on the screen, which you click to run a program?

Admittedly when I first used W8, I thought a fantastic idea would be for them to have the desktop with Icons that could be scrolled across the screen like on the Start Menu, now I'm glad I have both as it removes clutter from my desktop.
leexgx 30th April 2013, 20:34 Quote
I should if got an copy of windows 8 pro my self, but I did not want to give ms any money for an os I am likely going to have to tweak

my main issue with windows 8, is hidden stuff ,I am doing this post on mobile so it take some time to post silly things

WiFi been one, you cant remove networks unless they are in range (unless you use cmd commands to do it)

and how to remove an email account been under the add email page (there should be an manage button)

and updates that are 200-300mb is size (total updates are like 1gb or more from an fresh install bonkers)

there are other issues as well (most of them covered by this blog post)

also video divers are little flaky at the moment if you have 3 monitor setup (nvidia surrounded view was more an hack that hooked onto Aero, but that is gone so games run poorly) as to of my friends have had to go back to windows 7 so they could play games again at full speed

generally I do install startisback (I norm buy the 5 user one), I did use start8 but drag and drop and some other actions did not work correctly and your only allowed to use it on one pc where as startisback allows more for less price

there are good points as well, boot up times are faster if you still use an hdd(you not notice it if you have an SSD) programs seem to open faster

but the thing is windows 7 works does not require tweaking so I see no reason to use it on my main pc
loftie 30th April 2013, 20:50 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by leexgx
WiFi been one, you cant remove networks unless they are in range (unless you use cmd commands to do it)

and how to remove an email account been under the add email page (there should be an manage button)

and updates that are 200-300mb is size (total updates are like 1gb or more from an fresh install bonkers)

Agreed on the wifi, I have no idea what MS was thinking when they did that - unless there's away to do it which no-one has found, hopefully will be fixed.

Mail can remove an account within itself, bring up the right hand side menu (charm bar?) hit settings accounts click the account remove is at the bottom. Unless its the PC account, then well I don't know how you do it tbh.

I don't recall my updates being that big, but then I'm not checking them all to see.
Nexxo 30th April 2013, 20:58 Quote
The PC account can be changed or deleted in the User settings.
Woodspoon 30th April 2013, 23:42 Quote
Found something slightly odd about 8 on my netbook install.
Several programs most notably IE, Chrome and Firefox won't run in Metro mode due to low screen resolution but run fine in desktop mode without changing resolution.
WTF?
Ok so Metro is meant to be high resolution, but the screen is at it's max res and does not change between Metro and Desktop, so you'd think if it does not work in one mode it shouldn't work in the other.
Not really an issue, just seems odd.
dullonien 1st May 2013, 18:00 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodspoon
Found something slightly odd about 8 on my netbook install.
Several programs most notably IE, Chrome and Firefox won't run in Metro mode due to low screen resolution but run fine in desktop mode without changing resolution.
WTF?
Ok so Metro is meant to be high resolution, but the screen is at it's max res and does not change between Metro and Desktop, so you'd think if it does not work in one mode it shouldn't work in the other.
Not really an issue, just seems odd.

I believe that was done in an attempt to force manufacturers to use higher res screens in their tablets to compete with Apple. They did the same with WP7 and WP8, with high minimum specs and it's resulted in a slick Windows Phone experience on all devices.

I believe the minimum screen res is being reduced with W8.1, so you shouldn't have an issue then.
Woodspoon 1st May 2013, 20:20 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by dullonien


I believe that was done in an attempt to force manufacturers to use higher res screens in their tablets to compete with Apple. They did the same with WP7 and WP8, with high minimum specs and it's resulted in a slick Windows Phone experience on all devices.

I believe the minimum screen res is being reduced with W8.1, so you shouldn't have an issue then.

It's a non issue really as my dislike 8 has pushed me into dual booting linux on my netbook, I just wanted to see what it was like on a low power machine and discovered it did that., I guess they weren't thinking about netbooks, not that they have any reason to.
theshadow2001 1st May 2013, 20:22 Quote
The minimum res is to be lowered in the blue update I believe. Although you will have to google that to confirm it.
Doctor Hades 3rd May 2013, 09:10 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by loftie
I remember talking to MS reps coming up to and on release of W7. They were pushing that as a touch.

I'm curious as to what exactly you mean by the tablet interface, are you referring to the Start Screen?

Yes, I was referring to the Start screen which has garish colours and large touch-friendly icons compared with the desktop. The desktop icons are not exactly touch-friendly nor do they need to be since we use a mouse in that part of Windows.
Lazarus Dark 11th May 2013, 02:14 Quote
I used Win8 for a half hour and it was the most hilarious first impression of an OS I ever had. The stupidity of it on a non-touch laptop was just beyond ridiculous. With Steam on Linux and bluray support slowly getting there, I won't be getting another Windows OS after Win7
Sebbo 14th May 2013, 11:54 Quote
Anyone saying Windows 8 has no new desktop features over Windows 7 clearly needs to do some research.

1. As dullonien already mentioned, signing in with your Microsoft account means that a number of settings are automatically backed up to the cloud (including your desktop theme). This goes a bit further though and syncs them across PCs as well, and includes your IE history, favourites and stored logins too (and yes, I use IE over Chrome for a few reasons. It has definitely come some way since IE8).
2. File History. Easiest explanation for this is Apple's Time Machine. You now have journalled snapshots of your files to an external or network drive of your choice (if you run Server 2012, you can set the location for this in group policy)
3. Storage Spaces. Create a pool of drives, without the RAID controller requirement. You can also include external drives in the pool. There are resiliency options (2-way mirror, 3-way mirror or parity), and with support for thin provisioning the pool can be grown just by adding new disks (eg. thin-provision for 5PB with only 9TB of actual space to start with, and just grow the pool as you need more space by adding another disk). What's more, you can move the pool to another Windows 8 or Server 2012 machine and it will be picked up
4. Improved Multi-monitor support. For those of you running more than one monitor, you can now have the taskbar on each monitor so that you no longer need to keep moving your cursor back to the "main" monitor to select another application (although that option is still there). It can also be set so the taskbar on a monitor shows only the applications whose windows are in that monitor too. There's more options for your desktop background, from panorama images across all, to selecting individual images for each monitor
5. Proper UEFI support. UEFI motherboards are becoming more prevalent, and Windows 8 has proper support for it. You can reboot from Windows 8 directly into the UEFI firmware, if you have an SSD it will boot insanely quick (partly because you no longer have the old bios bogging down the POST process), and the boot drive can be GPT as well (for those who have only one disk which is also >3TB)
6. Generally runs better. I said above part of the quick boot times is from UEFI+SSD, but the other is that Windows 8 generally boots quicker, runs smoother and has a smaller footprint than Windows 7 and even XP. I say generally because it won't be true for all hardware configurations, but this is the experience most find.
7. Mount .iso and .vhd files directly from Windows Explorer (now called File Explorer). Don't think I have to do much explaining on this one
8. Desktop UI improvements. I'm mainly thinking of File Explorer and Task Manager here. Not everyone will like the ribbon in File Explorer, but there's many context-specific things it makes more accessible than the right-click menu does (including some things you would usually need to go into properties for, like disk defrag and cleanup). It also gives you hotkeys for a lot of functions that didn't have them before. As for Task Manager, you can now have heatmaps for resources your processes are using (the darker the square, the more CPU, Memory, Disk or Bandwidth that process is using), and the Performance tab has been revamped to give you more detail
9. Hyper-V. This is only available in Win 8 Pro, but you now have a full Hyper-V server running there as well (no more Virtual PC!). I know a lot of people will prefer VMware, but Hyper-V is catching up and has quite decent support for other guest operating systems.

These are just the ones I can come up with off the top of my head, and are probably the major ones. Do a little research (even just read the wiki page) and you'll likely discover more. When Microsoft were developing Windows 8 they definitely didn't have only touch screens in mind, but everyone gets so worked up about the Start Screen that they miss all these other great features and improvements
mdshann 14th May 2013, 19:34 Quote
If you didn't use "express settings" or whatever it was called during the initial oobe setup, you would have been able to skip entering a hotmail account.

Also if you push the power button on any computer since vista, especially big oem branded computers, the default is sleep. Even the default "power" button on the start menu puts it to sleep. You have to change the options in the Power Options control panel to get an actual "shut down" button or to get it to turn off from the power button being pressed.
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