Combining a PC, media streamer and NAS box
Posted on 16th Aug 2012 at 07:33 by Antony Leather with 36 comments
I have a love-hate relationship with NAS boxes. Part of me adores them. They offer a form redundancy for your data, can perform many functions such as FTP, photo and media servers, Bit-Torrent clients and many more, without the need for a PC. And they’re also smaller than a shoebox. The mere fact they’re designed to carry out a set number of tasks – far fewer than a Windows PC – means they’re very streamlined and usually easy and simple to use.
However, I also prefer to use a small, low-power PC for a majority of the tasks a NAS box offers. It’s more flexible, can offer support for video and music streaming services such as Netflix or Spotify, and for multitasking, even an old Core 2 CPU such as an E5300, which I currently have in a mini-ITX system under my TV, is happy to deal with backups, various download clients, 1080p streaming and playback, All at the same time, while remaining whisper-quiet.
However, a PC still isn’t a perfect companion for a ‘dumb’ TV. Using BBC iPlayer, Netflix or other streaming services that are slickly integrated into media streamers such as the WDTV Live, is fiddly and clunky in comparison. The array of Windows Media Centre add-ons go some way to solving this, but none are as simple and easy to use as a media streamer, and of course, few, if any, have the flexibility or power to carry out the basic features a NAS offers. Likewise, a media streamer is good for just that – streaming media. It can’t backup your files, offer anything by way of FTP or Bit-Torrent servers, and it can’t run cloud services or play games.
It’s a conundrum that’s infuriated all of us at bit-tech – there’s no one device that can sit under your TV and do everything. However, Thecus’ N2800 we looked at last week opened a door on an interesting idea. In fact it’s not even an idea, more a fact that if a company with a talent for building a small multi-capable devices puts its mind to it, it can create something that is tailored for these needs. Why then can’t companies like Thecus and Synology and Western Digital create a device that most people want?
For a majority of us, it needs to be able to connect to the Internet, and also straight to our TVs. It needs to be compatible with the usual video and music streaming services. Its UI must be clear and easy enough to use from a simple remote while you’re sitting in a chair on the other side of the room, but also able to set up various servers and configure backups from local PCs. I want to be able to install at least two hard disks in it, and it needs a smattering of USB ports and flash card slots. Its media player needs to support all popular music and video formats, and the ability to use Steam to play basic games would also be useful. It also needs a Blu-ray drive and the ability to connect to home theatre sound systems.
I know that’s a lot to ask, but it’s only one paragraph. It addresses all the shortcomings of HTPCs, NAS boxes and media streamers, which are still, after all this time, trying to be too much like each other, and not like the devices we all actually need.
As much as I wanted it to work, Windows Media Centre just hasn't been properly supported, but at the moment I'm soldiering on with a combined wireless keyboard and touchpad which is sufficient to navigate through Netflix, iPlayer and Spotify on my TV, while also offering full command of the Windows 7 PC it's connected to for dealing with the likes of downloads, backups. However, when I use things like XMBC, or a decent media streamer, I'm immediately reminded just how much easier things could be.
I'd be interested to know what set-ups you have in your lounge for dealing with this barrage of tasks, and if you too are pining after this 'perfect box'...
Click to enlarge - NAS boxes are constantly enlarging their feature sets to the point they're now basically mini-PCs
However, I also prefer to use a small, low-power PC for a majority of the tasks a NAS box offers. It’s more flexible, can offer support for video and music streaming services such as Netflix or Spotify, and for multitasking, even an old Core 2 CPU such as an E5300, which I currently have in a mini-ITX system under my TV, is happy to deal with backups, various download clients, 1080p streaming and playback, All at the same time, while remaining whisper-quiet.
Click to enlarge - Windows offers the best flexibility but even the best media centre-like UI's can't do everything and often need hours or days of research, trial and error.
However, a PC still isn’t a perfect companion for a ‘dumb’ TV. Using BBC iPlayer, Netflix or other streaming services that are slickly integrated into media streamers such as the WDTV Live, is fiddly and clunky in comparison. The array of Windows Media Centre add-ons go some way to solving this, but none are as simple and easy to use as a media streamer, and of course, few, if any, have the flexibility or power to carry out the basic features a NAS offers. Likewise, a media streamer is good for just that – streaming media. It can’t backup your files, offer anything by way of FTP or Bit-Torrent servers, and it can’t run cloud services or play games.
Click to enlarge - Media streamers are the best option for watching movies on your PC, but they all have limitations
It’s a conundrum that’s infuriated all of us at bit-tech – there’s no one device that can sit under your TV and do everything. However, Thecus’ N2800 we looked at last week opened a door on an interesting idea. In fact it’s not even an idea, more a fact that if a company with a talent for building a small multi-capable devices puts its mind to it, it can create something that is tailored for these needs. Why then can’t companies like Thecus and Synology and Western Digital create a device that most people want?
For a majority of us, it needs to be able to connect to the Internet, and also straight to our TVs. It needs to be compatible with the usual video and music streaming services. Its UI must be clear and easy enough to use from a simple remote while you’re sitting in a chair on the other side of the room, but also able to set up various servers and configure backups from local PCs. I want to be able to install at least two hard disks in it, and it needs a smattering of USB ports and flash card slots. Its media player needs to support all popular music and video formats, and the ability to use Steam to play basic games would also be useful. It also needs a Blu-ray drive and the ability to connect to home theatre sound systems.
I know that’s a lot to ask, but it’s only one paragraph. It addresses all the shortcomings of HTPCs, NAS boxes and media streamers, which are still, after all this time, trying to be too much like each other, and not like the devices we all actually need.
As much as I wanted it to work, Windows Media Centre just hasn't been properly supported, but at the moment I'm soldiering on with a combined wireless keyboard and touchpad which is sufficient to navigate through Netflix, iPlayer and Spotify on my TV, while also offering full command of the Windows 7 PC it's connected to for dealing with the likes of downloads, backups. However, when I use things like XMBC, or a decent media streamer, I'm immediately reminded just how much easier things could be.
I'd be interested to know what set-ups you have in your lounge for dealing with this barrage of tasks, and if you too are pining after this 'perfect box'...
36 Comments
Discuss in the forums ReplyThen you can use windows in the background for media storage, downloading, etc and the xbmc for media streaming?
Windows media centre has been a shambles every time I've attempted to use it over the years.
XBMC on top of a windows or linux system, on the other hand, is hugely expandable, and you can always drop out of it to perform any other tasks you may need to.
Personally, I use a tiny Mac Mini box which runs SABnzbd+, Couch Potato and Sickbeard, which all communicate with XBMC. The Mini is connected to a 50" LED TV. To interact with the OS, I use a bluetooth keyboard and wireless mouse. Movies and TV series are added to XBMC automatically, and a notification pops up telling me they're available to watch. I can even get it to send me a tweet or e-mail!
i put my NAS box in a cupboard running everything under the sun. then i stream using a jailbroken Apple TV, which was bought instead of other options for Airplay purposes.
I use a mini-itx system with an SSD under my TV for streaming and everything else and have a small NAS tucked away for storage. Works just fine and the noise is non-existent.
Clicking ? I hear my fans running at low RPM in the server, but not the hard drives.
Even the Mrs understands it and uses perfectly, if she's happy I'm happy
When I buy a house plan to have a hidden server running 24/7 for everything and have the house wired for music and media, mrs's is gonna love me soooo much
You forgot support for multiple Freeview/Freesat HD tuners.
I have a decent gaming PC with 4x freeview tuners in a Silverstone SST-GD04B connected to my TV. I use it mainly as a PVR and a gaming machine. Xbox controller means console style sofa comfort combined with PC quality graphics on a big screen and I have found Windows media Center to be an excellent PVR with adequate support for playback of downloaded / streaming video & audio. The PC is whisper quiet during video playback and not noticeable when playing games.
My main HTPC records TV and stores it locally in a shared folder, so if I want to watch something on my laptop, it appears straight away (the Recorded TV library includes this shared folder). I was disappointed to hear that MS isn't upgrading WMC for W8, but I'm glad it's still there as I don't know what I'd use for a PVR otherwise - I'm not aware of anything that can match it at present. Because of this I can put up with its shortcomings with regards to non-recorded content.
Two recent purchases have greatly improved my HTPC experience: Logitech Anywhere MX Mouse and Logitech Wireless Touch Keyboard K400
. They have worked perfectly without any dropouts so far which is a huge step forward from the cheap tat I was using before!
HP Proliant Microserver (they're still doing £100 off, only now 1.5ghz for about the same price) with XBMC, Sickbeard & SABnzbd.
I've also gone with WHS2011, its got the GPU acceleration that WHS lacks, automated backups of other machines in the house (4 HDDs, room for an SSD and more in the 5.25" bay area of the HP MS) and its pretty much on par with Win7 but can be picked up legit for around £38.
Media friendly, file storage (and backup), it all comes together to make a cracking little box.
As many others have said, XBMC is your best bet for a frontend (running under Windows if you must for Steam support), and keep all those noisy HDD's in a closet somewhere (the basement or loft) attached to an old PC running Linux.
That said, I don't really have any use for such rig. I already have a standalone NAS-box and all the media comes directly from my desktop.
XBMC Remote ?
I'm buying a Raspberry Pi for media streaming / netflix to my kitchen TV, and allows the wife to browse for recipes at the same time, which has a high WAF (wife acceptance factor).
Something tells me that this might not be such a bad recommendation...
- XBMC Remote allows you to control your XBMC, all of it. So if you are satisfied with XBMC music features, then use this one (of course you need to use separate speakers instead of the TV speakers for audio output) : https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.xbmc.android.remote
- Another option is MPD and one of the Android clients http://mpd.wikia.com/wiki/Clients
Seconded on this.
The remote app for XMBC is great. Better on Android than iPhone in my opinion.
Just built my HTPC and I've been blown away by XMBC.
Didn't even consider any other version of Windows to be honest, just slammed 7 on it, then put XMBC over the top.
Still playing with plugins to find what's the best fit for me at the moment but finding the Rooster Teeth plugin made my week :D
What bothers me a bit after trying it, is that I cant just press "play" and make it shuffle through my whole music collection. Or am I missing something?
AFAIK the Netflix addon for XBMC doesn't work to well for those of us in the UK - still far easier to do this in a browser :(
Listen to Music, click on the folder icon (the last one), long press on the folder, queue or play ? Don't ask me how to shuffle it, i didn't use this feature (for music play i use a remote login and then i use the Rhytmbox on server).
Did have a C2D machine for streaming but has been rescrently replaced with a Raspberry Pi with plans for more Raspberry Pi's around the house for all house music and connections to multiple TV's for streaming video.
SABnzbd + Sickbeard + CouchPotato + Serviio and a DLNA enabled TV.
Sharing the media stuff allows anyone on the home group to use it too.
If a company could combine all this well, and leave enough room for the customizability that most consumers (of this type of product) would want then I think there is a lot of money to be made.
The future of home media is in a all-in-one device that doesn't require a server room to run. First person to get it right will be well off.
My film collection is on a 2TB drive on a PC upstairs. The network is a mix of Ethernet cable & 500 AV Devolo homeplugs & I use a WD MyBookLIve for all the back-ups.
When I want to watch a film I use the Depicus App on my iPod touch to power up the HTPC & the PC upstairs that has the film collection, all from within the lounge. It is streamed and watched using XBMC.
Seems like this BR thing is really big in USA. Because pretty much the only ones who complain about missing BR support from something are from USA.
Currently XBMC stands head and shoulders above anything else in the market and if you're not worried about PVR functionality, you're pretty much already set, especially with the tvcatchup, iplayer, 4OD and ITV plugins.
As there are so many builds to suit specific hardware setups, I dont think it is an issue of finding one machine to rule them all. More a case of build a machine that suits you and let XBMC pull it all together.
I've got a Antec Fusion case (with the VFD taken out to fit another HDD behind) core i3 2120, 2 x 2TB, 1 x 1TB and a 64GB SSD. HDD noise isnt such a big problem as they tend to spin down fairly quickly when not in use and as most programs run off the SSD they only start up when playing local content. Plus the computer is right by the tv so while it's on you don't really hear it.
I've also got a TBS Dual Freesat card, taking care of PVR duties under WMC7. My biggest problem is constantly swapping between WMC7 and XBMC when watching films and Live TV. There is a little plugin that lets you jump between the two programs but Ideally I'd love to get shot of WMC7 entirely. Codec support under WMC7 is awful from the get go, forget subtitles, dual audio files, exotic formats and the like, not least the UI design which leaves a huge amount to be desired. Fortunately this is where XBMC excels (especially the Aeon Nox skin).
I'm going down the Pi route for other rooms / bedrooms, but had the OUYA already been here, I probably would have given it a try, given the partnership they have already formed with XBMC (or vice versa).
I wouldn't say my setup is 100% perfect, but it's very nearly there. For me at least :)
The argument for a TV License (trust me, it's only needed if you watch TV channels broadcast normally or simulcast on the net).... becomes, well... a little silly.