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What's coming in Windows 8?

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yakyb 9th June 2011, 12:57 Quote
Microsoft have actually released one hell of a lot of really good stuff recently

Windows 7 was the start
Silverlight is actually really good (although isn't likely to really catch on as it should)
WP7 is fantastic
XNA is great
Azure has been around for some time now
and windows Live is actually pretty cool

The only issue is they have no idea how to market any of this. and make it appear as one system if they can get this right with Windows 8 (and if it follows WP7 it will) then we are looking at a greet system

presonally i will probably not use the touch interface much (unless i buy a tablet) but if i do it looks pretty cool
Xir 9th June 2011, 13:00 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by runadumb
...the traditional PC is dying. For most people now PC's are just a gateway onto the internet which is where the real interest now lays.
And for home use, I agree.
For work...

I use 33 PC's regularly.
30 aren't connected to the internet, don't need to, they run machines that need to do the exact same thing for 10 years on end. :D
one of these 3 would benefit from the new UI...all others wouldn't.
Adnoctum 9th June 2011, 13:02 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by runadumb
I think Microsoft did exactly what they needed too do. For everyone saying "just give us the old ways" you seem to miss the point that the traditional PC is dying. For most people now PC's are just a gateway onto the internet which is where the real interest now lays. We can access the internet in a growing number of ways that are easier than on a normal PC.

Touch-screens make access to the Internet easier ONLY if you don't have a KB+M. It is ludicrous to think that most people prefer to use the Internet on tiny devices and screens over a desktop/laptop.
Quote:
Originally Posted by runadumb
The startling rise of tablets has proven that people just want a streamlined experience. I still can't get over the success of the ipad, which, at least at launch was pretty ****. I still wouldn't even consider buying one or any other current tablet for that matter. However Windows 8 may change that due to it's adaptive potential.

No, it just means that a new device is filling a previously unfilled need, not that such growth is sustainable. Come back with this comment when people start replacing their desktop/laptop with a tablet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by runadumb

I think Microsoft nailed it with this design, and while I doubt I will be using that overlay on my desktop PC, it has so much potential a tablet/laptop device. I can't wait too see more.

I think you haven't read the article properly. THIS is the UI for W8, not an overlay. It is the UI for all W8 devices, including desktop. Even if you have a 30in monitor. It is the "traditional" UI that is the overlay. How enthusiastic are you now?
Ayrto 9th June 2011, 13:04 Quote
Windows 7.2?
SlowMotionSuicide 9th June 2011, 13:15 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by phuzz
(o/t I'm 30 and I still find it pretty easy to pick up new interfaces. Is there a cut off point?)

Mine was somewhere around 25, so I guess your mileage may vary. I despise change when it is just for the sake of it.

Also, I'm not in a hurry to blow another 200€ to an OS. 7 is just fine tyvm.
pullmyfoot 9th June 2011, 13:19 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by r8bwp
i`ve used windows from the day of its birth, some transitions have been inspired from what was, others well the screams of WTF have you done could be heard miles away.

I am not against change but Microsoft does have good record of bloopers especially in their operating systems. Some of them I hated so much, sometimes returning to the previous version. I have only recently laid to rest my XP PRO (cautiously) for WIN7. We all know the bloopers and the taste it left in our mouths and the hole it left in our wallets.

I`ll not be changing in a hurry to win8, Microsoft should bear in mind that the older generation doesn`t like constantly relearning or searching for the item (icon) file folder. Well it used to be there, where have they put it now. As you get older you like change less and less.

All very well for the tablet and the Iphone generation and the throwaway tech who can adapt to the change quickly, at 47 I`m starting to appreciate knowing where everything goes.

If the keyboard was drastically changed in its layout, remapping the keyboard would be a nightmare in my head (fighting to two layouts, well it used to be there! AARRGGHH)

On the other hand it took me a long time to switch to win7 64 ultimate and it was a lot less painful and worrysome than I had expected (THANKS VISTA!!! PIECE OF S*IT. I WANT MY MONEY BACK!!!!).
Having said that I quite like win7 64 ultimate and has been very stable with very few glitches(My opinion and my needs).
PHEW!! that was a relief.

I suppose what I`m trying to say is:
i`m getting older(sniff, grumble ,moan)
I don`t want to be searching for something when I knew where it was or how it worked.
Deciding if a new operating system is a white elephant and a waste of money.(can i have my money back. NO!)
I don`t own a console and never will.
I don`t own a tablet and never will. I`m sure RSI will be an issue at some time for these people.
My mobile is a samsung D500(OLD)
I`ll upgrade the hardware every 3 yrs but the operating system, well thats a different matter.

I respect that I am biaised from my own perspective, experiences and my needs are different from other users.

Im 20 and I also very cautiously moved from XP to 7.
Ive never owned a console.
I like to overclock my computer and stuff it with high performance parts.
I upgrade every 2+ years.
I dont own a tablet and never see for now why I will need to.

I have one computer with Vista and one with 7. I dont love the Vista but I dont hate it either. Becasue of this I cant be bothered to change it to 7, but its something I wish I didnt do but can live with. I love my W7 PC.

Youre not that old after all :)
Madness_3d 9th June 2011, 13:25 Quote
They better not make Win 7 EOL... Not liking all this business
Mentai 9th June 2011, 13:28 Quote
I'm pretty sad about the lack of legacy support. Decent legacy support means the difference between a system that can do everything and one that relies on an app store that competes with iOS. MS should be playing to the strengths of a PC based tablet system instead of trying to copy Apple.

In terms of the UI, the obsession with unified UI across all platforms is stupid and I hope all companies get over it soon. Congrats on coming up with the perfect UI for tablets, I'm not letting that crap touch my PC.
jrs77 9th June 2011, 13:39 Quote
Leave my desktop alone. I don't need any of those craptastic interfaces on a machine that's ment for doing real work.

Microsoft should simply develop a mobile OS and a leave the desktop UI like it is. Cramming all into a single OS is the worst idea they could've come up with. They should leave this crap to Apple, who are starting to do exactly the same with MacOS X Lion and it's dashboard and Apps etc.
r8bwp 9th June 2011, 14:06 Quote
@phuzz (o/t I'm 30 and I still find it pretty easy to pick up new interfaces. Is there a cut off point?)

I have had to fix/repair/reinstall so many computers with different operating systems each with their own different menus layouts flaws and pitfalls.

Is there a cut off point, sure(47 for me) when the operating system keeps changing and it alienates or makes life harder for the user. When keeping up with the latest gadget isn`t the be all and end all of your life beacause you:know your old one better, it does what you needed it to do, with as little fuss and stress possible.

I have city and guilds advanced diploma in IT(not the highest qualification by a long chalk) and as such i get asked to fix computers. I hate the fact I have had to learn and discard different operating sytems with different flaws different menus/layouts.

Todays society thinks its ok to put out broken software. Oh there might be a patch if enough people complain.
But hey who cares, we`ll just put out another crap operating system in another five years(more money).

At 30 your at your peak give or take two years, down hill from there. As for me as I get older I want to spend less time on learning YET another platform and its flaws(to be discarded in the future) and get on with the more important things life.




Guess i have to laugh I was 30 once too, lol.

As much as I loathe Bill Gates for his flawed operating systems, I have to admire the man for putting computers into every home.

The point being, not everyone is tech savvy, or wants to spend hours learning a new operating system that used to take 5 mins to get the job done. At some stage time becomes precious,or just cant be bothered Learning and discarding new operating system has become a pain in the butt(from 3.11 to win7 (in how many years)). I love nothing better than killing a zombie in left4dead but rarely play left for dead2 just because i don`t like it., the same goes for operating systems.

Another Marmite moment!
runadumb 9th June 2011, 14:15 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adnoctum

I think you haven't read the article properly. THIS is the UI for W8, not an overlay. It is the UI for all W8 devices, including desktop. Even if you have a 30in monitor. It is the "traditional" UI that is the overlay. How enthusiastic are you now?

You may want too re-read it yourself or even watch the video. The normal desktop interface is but a mouse click away. The desktop experience is still there for those that want it, ie, probably anyone not using it as a tablet.
LJF 9th June 2011, 14:24 Quote
I'm amused by some of the negative comments here. It's as though folks think Microsoft don't have an R&D department. I'm fairly sure that all the concerns people are raising here will be (or have been) raised during design and development process.

I personally like the 'tile' approach. It's appears to be a more unified and stylised system that incorporates widgets and shortcut icons. Basically it does away with desktop backgrounds, which for all intents and purposes, are simply useless pictures. (but like in WP7, you can assign a picture to a homescreen tile if you're desperate for some stimulus while you sit and stare at length at the home screen).

I'm pretty sure that it will be adaptable to suit standard desktop needs - resizable user definded tiles would be the key. A small tile that opens a programme is exactly the same as an icon on windows 95 desktop. If you want a data feed or some further information from that 'tile' make it slightly larger to show it and it is essentially a widget.

As technology advances and devices become unified this adaptive UI will probably be context sensitive. Much like you can use time rules and gps locations to determine the ringtone and other settings on a phone already.

MS probably know people don't want to lean over and maul their monitor to open microsoft word to type using a physical keyboard. So by docking your tablet you're interface would adapt to use the most obvious input. I'd go as far as to say you may be able to define your set up based on the context.

If I was carrying my "imaginary-portable-personal-cloud connected-tablet computer" around in my pocket it's unlikely that I would want to use microsoft excel in this state for instance. That icon or link tile wouldnt even appear on my screen but I would still be able to access it. It would show me, news feeds, weather reports, emails, facebook etc. If i connected it to a tv/hi-fi, the UI would detect this and reorganise - the media player would be the key feature.

Then If I docked the computer to a mouse and keyboard, based on my preferences, it would bring up productivity tiles, excel, photoshop, cad etc. arranged in an easily accessible manner like the desktop icons I currently have on screen now.



...Sorry for going off on a bit of a flight of fancy there, i'm making sweeping assumptions there, I know, but these are the kind of things I would like to see implemented...

I agree it might be tricky to get used a new approach but things change. I think we should embrace it. If it doesnt work, things will revert back to the way they are now, i'm fairly sure.
r8bwp 9th June 2011, 14:24 Quote
@Pullymyfoot

Thank you lol. :)
Tattysnuc 9th June 2011, 14:31 Quote
Could work if MS implement this guided by the users, as opposed to telling the users how they should use it.

IF this is something that is configurable so that it can be used SEAMLESSLY with the exiting OS front end, then this is great move forward. Otherwise people will hold back from upgrading "en mass" like they did with Vista....

Maybe MS need to split their model into Kernal and front end, and then let the user choose/configure how the front end is set up and interacts rather than forcing their design decisions onto us...
SMIFFYDUDE 9th June 2011, 14:39 Quote
It took me ages to get use the the subtle differences when moving from 98 to XP. Desktop touch screens are a terrible gimmick that are more trouble than their worth.
runadumb 9th June 2011, 14:40 Quote
Okay it's clear a lot of people have no idea what is going on here. That tile UI is only in conjunction with the normal desktop. The best way too see it in action is here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WDry3QUllYk.

Yes it's 32 minutes long but you can skip the crap at the start and the end. Watch this THEN come back here and comment.
r8bwp 9th June 2011, 14:47 Quote
There have been many valid points, some I hadn`t thought of,

Will it be better, will it make life easier, will it do what you want it to do.is it safer(never some hacker will just have to prove a point or be malicious).

I admit i am very biaised and have felt cheated by certain operating systems as a consumer and engineer.

I like win7 ult and hope that future operating sytems will be user friendly and stable.

Computers are after all hardware software and interface. Connecting your devices is becoming more and more important.

Instead of a new operating sytem that everyone sooner or later has to buy, why not upgrades for the features you need.
Apocalypso 9th June 2011, 14:51 Quote
Hopefully they'll change their minds and allow desktop users to disable it.

On tablets, mobiles, touch screens etc I can see it's place but imo it's unnecessary fluff on a PC.
Woodspoon 9th June 2011, 15:02 Quote
Yuck!
That new UI looks nasty, it looks like "my first PC" or something like that.
Kind of reminds me of iOS as well for some reason, which I do not like.
I think it's also going to cause quite a few problems for casual PC users adapting to the new UI, I know a few people who had problems dealing with the update to IE9 let alone a whole UI change.
azazel1024 9th June 2011, 15:14 Quote
Give me good interoperability between tablets and PCs and almost as good phones and PCs and you have me won. This is with the condition that you LEAVE a real friggen file system that I can access, not this IOS bullcrap, allow me nearly unfettered access to customize a bizillion settings like I can do know in Windows and leave things like the command console and I'll be happy. I want something simple on a tablet with the option of something more complex and low level that I can access in "the background", on a PC I want the opposite. Both living together and working pretty much the same on both systems with the exception of what I am using as an input device would be lovely and brilliant.

I just fear that this is the first step toward the loss of being able to truely customize Windows the way you need it to be. Don't get me wrong, for 90% of stuff on a tablet I can live with iOS and I like it suprisingly enough (I have an iPad2) and the missing 10% is a little aggrevating, but I can deal just fine. On a desktop something like that I'd be able to do about 40% of what I need to and that missing 60% would piss me off beyond belief. It would also mean that I'd be living with legacy Windows 7 until I litteraly couldn't either get hardware to support it anymore or else critical software just wouldn't run on it.

I am fine if this ends up being like the move to Windows 95 where you have Windows as THE graphical interface and need to open a DOS shell to do a lot of low level stuff (though that said, you could do a heck of a lot of that stuff through the interface easily or more easily). Obfuscate and make easier the Windows 8 interface all you want and the same with future windows OS, but leave me my "classical-ish" Windows GUI and all of its bizzillion and one options underneath, to the side, etc that I can access when I need to fine tune something.

I do fear the move away from KB+M, because as a KB+M and a touch screen user I can tell you that office productivity, systems administrator, coding and general lengthy typing (more than about a paragraph at a time) is much more exhausting, difficult, etc to do with a touch screen interface, I don't care if it is a 14" touch screen or a 7" touch screen (though obviously a large one would be a little easier, but also more cumbersome). Lets not even discuss a monitor as a touch screen. Shudder.

My hope is that MS can intelligently design both the metro and aero interfaces living together and operating well with both touch screen and KB+M. Obviously one is probably going to be better than the other for each interface, but if touch screen works brilliantly with the metro GUI and KB+M works okay (as in not frustrating, extremely limited, error prone, etc) and with the aero GUI KB+M works brilliantly and touch screen works okay (with the above caveats) then I think its a winner possibly.

I am very catiously optimistic. Why, because I hope MS hasn't lost their sanity and besides, its all I can do. Its that or just go in to a fugue of depression.
azazel1024 9th June 2011, 15:15 Quote
Oh for the new UI from the comments MS has made that I've read it seems like the Metro UI on a PC will be the default login splash screen, but after that you can drop directly in to Aero (or whatever they might call it in Windows 8) after logining in as default option. I can like with Metro as a splash screen on my PC, more than that and no thank you sir.
mclean007 9th June 2011, 15:39 Quote
Quote:
look at how quickly Apple moved over from PowerPC to x86 – but that was an OS-wide change in processor architecture, rather than a decision to run an OS on two architectures concurrently.
Actually OS X supported both Intel and PowerPC from 2006 to 2009, in both OS X 10.4 and 10.5 (Tiger and Leopard). These days the majority of PowerPC Macs have been retired (and anyway Apple's sales have soared since the introduction of the first Intel Macs) so Intel Macs now massively outnumber PowerPC ones and most applications are written for Intel only, but there was quite a while where Apple and developers had to cope with both, using universal binaries and the Rosetta Stone virtualisation layer.
Th3Maverick 9th June 2011, 15:45 Quote
I think this COULD be hawtness. If I no longer have to wait for explorer (and the bulk of the rest of the OS) just to utilize my most used programs, it would be a HUGE step forward for desktop OS. I remember a couple of years ago everyone bitching because MS only releases their operating system as a huge bundle and they wanted it put into discrete "boxes", so they could pay for, download, and use only what they wanted out of the OS. I would like it...Hell, I spent 3 days tweaking a 7 install in vLite to get the install down below 3GB; it would be very polite of MS to do that for me.

Maybe that's where this is headed? A lightweight primary OS comprised of these "tile" thingies as its interface, with a bulkier, more traditional "professional" version available? It would make sense if they wanted to use this on a wider variety of platforms.

Somehow, sadly, I don't think that is what MS has in mind, though. I disagree with the article; I think this is going to be a media center-style add on, and it will take some doing to convince me otherwise.
EdwardTeach 9th June 2011, 16:58 Quote
No for a desktop PC. It is a touch centric interface that will be annoying on a desktop. I never want to have a touchscreen for my desktop either, they get dirty quickly and will cause arm strain.

I do however own a Dell Duo (flip screen netbook/touchscreen tablet) I am looking forward to trying W8 on that!
KayDat 9th June 2011, 17:15 Quote
Quote:
Originally Posted by mclean007
Actually OS X supported both Intel and PowerPC from 2006 to 2009, in both OS X 10.4 and 10.5 (Tiger and Leopard). These days the majority of PowerPC Macs have been retired (and anyway Apple's sales have soared since the introduction of the first Intel Macs) so Intel Macs now massively outnumber PowerPC ones and most applications are written for Intel only, but there was quite a while where Apple and developers had to cope with both, using universal binaries and the Rosetta Stone virtualisation layer.

The fact that you can't virtualise x86 on ARM might mean that devs code for ARM, and then just virtualise on x86 instead. Might be a performance hit, but you can afford the hit, in a sense, seeing as x86 is being portrayed as desk-bound behemoth compared to portable battery powered ARM devices.
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